The Breitling Watch Source Forums

coeve means that all the parts of the watch are of the same period. Ideally the watch is completely intact, that is with no pieces replaced, expecially if of another period. And, if there is a kit, the kit also must be the real one or at least the same of the original.
I see your point about taxes, it's true, but the difference here is that a watch virtually without a kit (or with someone else's kit) has been sold at the price of a watch with its original kit.

Box is definitely fake and the date on paperwork is suspicious unless it was a NOS piece but the watch looks consistent with other Chronomats from about 1995. Breitling would use up stock of dials and hand sets during a change over to an updated design.

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For more information on identifying Breitling replicas, please visit my web site
http://f4buz.com/watches/breitling/fakes/fakes.html

how can all this be checked?

sorry, but what more do you want "checked" ?
a) watch is authentic
b) papers are authentic, could be original to the watch if it was lying at the AD for some years and was finally
sold in 2008, or they might not belong to this watch.
c) boxes are fake

whatever you do with this information is up to you, of course, but opinions are quite unanimous here,

I was referring to papers. Ok, you're right:
a) ok
c) ok

but my doubt on papers is because of these:
1 - why two different juwelers names? Is this normal? Can you help me in reading it?
2 - date: could it be plausible that a watch stays 10 years on a shelf? And even if it was so, the watch wouldn't be used as this obviously is.

we could discuss this for ages, but all would be theoretic.

1-signatures: maybe one AD could not sell it and another AD took it off him ?
you could check whether both companies truly are ADs and contact them ?
2-date: we have seen watches worn for less than the 3+ years that did looks worse, another theory could be the watch was sold earlier and the owner/somebody filled in the date in November 2008 when he had a warranty claim (successfully or not), "open" papers are quite frequent !

actually few hours ago I phoned and wrote to the juweler in Breme, as the other one is not clear who is... could be in Argentina!
I asked them if they have a record of this watch in their archives and I'm waiting for his response...

I think trying to prove the full authenticity of the warranty card is obsessive and fruitless as the warranty has long since expired and the watch itself is real regardless.

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Breitling (Navitimer A23322, Aerospace, Chronomat Blackbird, Chronomat A13352 +UTC)
Jaeger-LeCoultre Reverso Gran Sport, Zenith Elite 670
Marathon (SAR, JSAR), Ollech & Wajs Cobra

well, the value of a watch with or without it's full kit differs significantly

Exactly what value do you feel that an expired warranty adds?

This is really starting to get silly - you have been told over and over that the watch is real and yet you continue to look for reasons not to pay the price that you contracted to pay.

This sounds really surreal. You really don't know which is the difference for a collector between a complete set or just the watch?

This is all yours conclusion, offensive and totally meaningless.
Who told you that? Who allowed you to talk with me this way?
I already spoke with the seller this morning and there are no problems of the kind you mention, nevertheless I want to know if what I have is or is not a fake. Is this wrong? I believe not.
And, in any case, he offers full refund for a week in case I dislike the watch.

If I wanted not to pay for a watch, I wouldn't had bid!

@ Rik
That's good to hear because a lot of what you have been posting comes across (to those of us who speak English as our first, and probably only, language) as looking for reasons not to pay.

I don't think anyone here is being offensive. We have all said the watch is real but have said the box is fake and questioned the paperwork. If that causes you a problem, it is your choice to raise the matter with the seller. I am not an expert on eBay and, in particular, it's t&c, but I've always assumed that by bidding on an item, you are accepting that you will buy it as seen/described. Also, I've always assumed the time to question the authenticity of an item is before, not after, the auction ends. "Caveat emptor" if you are familiar with the phrase.

With regard to your question of how much a full set of papers adds to the value of the watch, I would have to say that in the case of a 15 year old watch, it is probably minimal. Maybe $50 at the most.

IMHO, you've won a nice old Chronomat which you should be proud to own. Enjoy it!

_________________

For more information on identifying Breitling replicas, please visit my web site
http://f4buz.com/watches/breitling/fakes/fakes.html

> "Caveat emptor"
absolutely! That's my real mistake. I saw this auction at the last moment, the watch was nice but I didn't had time to do my homeworks as I usually do. So I have to do them now, because in any case I hate and don't want fakes (watch, papers, all): I don't want to feed fake industry!


> by bidding on an item, you are accepting that you will buy it as seen/described
again, absolutely. But now: what if the description is not truthful? In this case, probably, not in bad faith, anyway they offer the return with full refund, so I don't believe they are not honest.


In many other cases I let auctions go because they were suspect or the set was incomplete (I wanted the real complete set), even with more beautifull watches, so then, after winning this one, I run to post here hoping to find it was all right. You can imagine my disappoint reading that I could throw box and papers and just keep the watch: this one is just like many others I let go!


> With regard to your question of how much a full set of papers adds to the value of the watch, I would have to say
> that in the case of a 15 year old watch, it is probably minimal. Maybe $50 at the most.

I argue that depends on the name. For a Tissot it's probably true, absolutely the opposite for a Rolex or a Breitling or Omega. In certain cases older means more value (some vintage Longines box are pieces of art).
Try to check prices of only boxes sold on ebay! You'll be amazed. Much more then 50$.

In conclusion I appreciated your competent help, this is a real good forum. Now I'll wait for the jewellers' answer and then decide what to do.


P.S.
what's t&c ?

Hi Rik,

You really seem to have a bit of pent up energy - - you need to go for a run.

The 'experts' here are giving you the benefit of their knowledge 'free of charge' so might I suggest a slice or two of humble crumble?

These guys are a lot like Manchester United - 'Not Arrogant, Just Better' and their advice may come across that way sometimes.

Read the post - it's plain to understand - take it or leave it where it is - but when you ask for help and don't like the answers, biting your lip before posting often saves a red face later.

p.s t&c -terms & conditions.

p.p.s. It's only a watch. IMO.

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From now on, I’m watching everything you do with a fine-tuned comb.

the translation I got of this phrase is not very kind...

I guess I already expressed my appreciation for that, but I renew it, just in case it's not clear

where in particular? We're all expressing personal ideas here: I guess I did the same in full respect of other's.
I believe that the real values of a forum like this are two: the deep knowledge of some members and the possibility of discussing ideas, not to accept all as coming from the Bible. That's what I did with my questions.

I took it. They shipped yesterday. I hope it arrives today.
The german jewelers answered me that the watch is too old so they don't have any record of it.
Now I'm impatient to receive it.


well... amounts of money are always relative... I mean: 100 euros are a big amount or a small one? It depends...