The Breitling Watch Source Forums

Wow this watch thing has hit me hard! I now want a in-house movement watch and the two I had in mind were the Rolex Sub 16610LV, How limited is it BTW?, and maybe a Breitling non-chrono but that was put on hold because of styling and it does not look like any thing is, or will be, to my tastes there. Unfortunately the B-01 is not for me either. Even now I am been offered new Evo's at hugely discounted prices -25% to -30% on the list which is very tempting but I am going to stick to my guns and go for a in-house. So that leaves the Sub. 50, what I want is opinions on it, is it a good buy as regards a investment. Every sale person talks it up so much its it silly. I found a 07 second hand one in a non AD going for 650 euro more than what I can get one new for ! The watch I am currently looking at is, so I am told a 2010 Sub 50 with a collectible serial number. I believe I am getting the best possible price on it also. With regards the "investment" I would like to have your opinions on the money I am about to pump into in. Its the initial hit that I hate in that you walk into AD and one week late you down 30%-40% on what you payed.
I do not intend on passing on or any thing like that, indeed I think it will be keeping for a long time.
So is this watch as good of a buy as I am led to believe?

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Breanach78

A Few Breitlings.

They're not limited, but there is a reasonably strong demand for them.

They hold their value pretty well (and generally command a premium of at least a few hundred dollars or pounds over a regular 16610) but I don't think it makes sense to buy one as an investment - it's unlikely to go up in value. There was huge hype about them when they were released but that has largely worn off. Sounds to me like those sales people you have been talking to are overstating the case.

As for collectible serial number, I'm not sure there is such a thing. It could be a reference to the 'random' serial numbers that Rolex introduced after the V-series. At the moment I believe these command a small premium because they are recent and there are relatively fewer of them, but that may not be the case in a few years.

I'm not trying to talk you out of it, it's a great watch (I assume the reference to 650 euro is a typo, by the way), and the initial depreciation hit won't be as bad as with most other brands. But IMO you should only buy it if you genuinely want one, not because you think the deal's too good to pass up.

I had one myself a couple of years back - there are one or two pictures of it on here somewhere. In terms of being limited, it's actually not at all. Of course it was extremely limited when I was looking to buy one.......at least that's what the ADs maintained. Consequently I waited well over a year for one, and when it came in there was zero discount. Then a few months later, interest in the LV started to wain a little and, oh look, Rolex suddenly found thousands of them and the market became saturated. So much so in fact that when I came to sell it, a watch trader I know very well told me I'd be better off buying a black bezel insert and selling it that way!

Things have reversed a little on that now and LVs are garnering a little more respect again so investment wise, well, a Rolex is a Rolex after all.

In terms of the watch, the head was immaculately made and I personally love the green bezel. The movement was super-smooth and deadly accurate too. However the bracelet and clasp on those older models is frankly a joke IMO. Hollow centre links and a pressed tin-foil clasp did not warrant the asking price IMO. I also found it too small after years of so it had to go.

Basically if you like the older subbies then the LV is still the one to have IMO. But if you like a bit of heft and size, then it's probably not.

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Driver8

Site Moderator

100% is not for a "investment" but its sure nice to know that if i decide in 5 years to move it on there is a slight possibility that i maybe get my money back not 50% less of it! 650 euro is correct. A second hand watch, 2007, was in a dealer for 650e more that i can get it new for. You are correct regards the serial number in that i think its a nice random one. I.E. 50000 or whatever it maybe.

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Breanach78

A Few Breitlings.

D-serial would be the first release and moderately collectible amongst the Rolex crowd. Any LV should command about 300 USD over a standard 16610 in identical condition. I don't believe the 16610LV made it to the random or G-serial which would be moderately rare if in existence. If you want it, find a documented piece for the best price and enjoy. As with almost any Rolex, re-sale value is unmatched compared to most other brands. A better 'investment' Rolex from this period would be a GMTII with the 3186 movement. Good luck with your search!

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Steelfish GMT LE (white)

would i be correct in saying that it would even hold its value, be a better general Rolex buy, and take less of a hit than a new model sub which is also a possibilty open to me. This new one means nothing to me and i cant get away from the fact that the lv is a limited edition, even though truly it may that limited at all. also thanks, driver8, if i want heft i ll pull out my SF, which btw, is never going. Ever. The LV is great size for me and i totally dig the understated look of a sub. Be it the LV or not.

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Breanach78

A Few Breitlings.

seems like a lot of Rolex converts lately. i have to admit i am starting to like the brand more and more each day. I have to agree with others, not to sure how good this would be as an investment. however if you did sell it down the road youre likely to take less of a hit than most other brands. if you are getting a good deal on the piece and you really like it, then i say pull the trigger. its a great watch and can be worn for almost every ocassion.

If by "new" Sub you mean 116610, I would go for that. Top notch piece, and as Driver mentioned, you wont be bitterly disappointed with the bracelet/clasp of the older models. Just go to a Rolex AD and check an old style model next to any new style model. The difference is huge.

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-RJ

I agree about the D-serial, particularly if it's a 'fat 4' model.

I've noticed that GMTIIs with the 3186 movement are doing extremely well on the second hand market, at least if asking prices are any guide. I can't help wondering if that will continue indefinitely - it's a huge premium for a relatively small difference in the movement. Having said that, Rolex collectors seem to attach great importance to relatively small differences (the fat 4 being a good example).

I don't think the new Sub will be remotely collectible, by the way. It's a great watch but I'm sure Rolex are going to produce it in large numbers - they will be everywhere in a few years.

Ya, for sure the new one is hot. But, now i could be worng about this, over here its close on 2k euro more that i can get the LV for. I dont know but i am certainally not felling that differance.

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Breanach78

A Few Breitlings.

hi otto. Fat 4? Please.

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Breanach78

A Few Breitlings.

The first LVs had a different 4 (in the '40' mark on the bezel) than later models. I know a few people who think this may ultimately turn out to be the most collectible version of the LV.

See here for a pic of one:
http://rolex.watchprosite.com/show-foru ... ti-555901/

Cool. Thanks Otto. Nice to know.

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Breanach78

A Few Breitlings.

Are you saying 2000 euros more for a Sub C than a new regular Sub? That's a lot - it's about $1,000 US here.

But having worn a hollow center link model with that less than substantial clasp, I can attest the new models with the heavy bracelets and new clasps are worth at least $1,000US to me. The clasp mechanisms alone are worth it - the ones on the Sub and different one on the GMT Master IIc and Datejust 2 are simply amazing and nearly infinitely adjustable. They are masterpieces of bracelet engineering - the best I've worn...PERIOD!

The Sub C clasp is adjustable to 5 postions on the fly. The GMT Master IIc and DJ2 have a single 5mm adjustment on the fly, but also a 3 position adjustment in the clasp that requires using a tool, similar to Breitling clasps.

I'd think long and hard before getting the old bracelet and clasp. For some it's no big deal at all. For me it was a mistake I needed to undo.

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SHARKMAN

I have a 2000 model GMT and the more I try on newer watches their bracelets put the old Rolex one to shame. I'm not letting go of the GMT for personal reasons but if you have some nice newer watches I would suggest you try an old bracelet model and wear it for a while before you buy.

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Scott

AP Royal Oak 15400, silver
Zenith Chronomaster El Primero Classic Cars
Vintage gold Corum
Rolex DJ 36 TT, oyster dial, oyster/smooth
Baume & Mercier Riviera 200m, silver dial/aquamarine bezel
Breitling Superocean 57, rose/stainless