The Breitling Watch Source Forums

seller reagon1972 (0) is selling this chronomat on ebay. is it a super avenger model? is it real? take a look. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 2759.l1259

No, not a Chronomat a Chrono Avenger M1 I think, it looks fake though. The red paint on sec hand looks too thick and the lume dots look domed and the dot at 7 o'clock is smudged. I'll hold on for the experts to call on though.

_________________
Breitling (Navitimer A23322, Aerospace, Chronomat Blackbird, Chronomat A13352 +UTC)
Jaeger-LeCoultre Reverso Gran Sport, Zenith Elite 670
Marathon (SAR, JSAR), Ollech & Wajs Cobra

Avenger Seawolf Chrono fake.
Reported.

Are you sure its not a Chrono Avenger M1?

http://www.breitlingsource.com/watch_de ... ne_38.html

_________________
Breitling (Navitimer A23322, Aerospace, Chronomat Blackbird, Chronomat A13352 +UTC)
Jaeger-LeCoultre Reverso Gran Sport, Zenith Elite 670
Marathon (SAR, JSAR), Ollech & Wajs Cobra

It could be based on the yachting marks (correct for the M1) but the positioning or "mal-postioning of the #5 marker looks more like ASC to me. Either way it's fake. Horrible lume, sunken datewheel, nasty arabics.

Reported.

Not 100% sure but I think it could well be real. Reasons...

1. It's definitely a Chrono Avenger M1 Yachting and I've never seen/heard of a replica of this model.
2. I've never seen/heard of a Breitling replica using an ETA 251.232 movement. Sub-dials are normally wrong and there is only a big chrono seconds hand.
3. This pic of a Chrono Avenger M1 Yachting has the 5 cutting into the date aperture.



Against this, since the chrono seconds/minutes hands (assuming it's real) have both been re-set to zero, I'd expect the chrono hours and 1/10 seconds to be likewise reading zero. It's possible they have become misaligned if the seller has been playing with the pushers.

If the seller can provide a pic showing both the chrono seconds and minutes hands, that would settle the matter.

_________________

For more information on identifying Breitling replicas, please visit my web site
http://f4buz.com/watches/breitling/fakes/fakes.html

I agree that it's M1 and Sharky's picture does show the #5 to be positioned as the watch in the auction but I would still have to go with fake. The 7 lume dot is doubled IMO. The arabics are thicker at #11 and #1. Also these appear stenciled where the gen looks applied. (Did this model come with both?) The date wheel is misaligned. For the life of me I can't see two hands although it's possible they are there and very well aligned. The subdial hands look thicker and just of a gray color to me as well.

I'm still thinking definitely fake.

........although when you compare it to this pic from the site I think the arabics look better (stenciled instead of applied?)and I think the subdial hands improve as well. I still can't get over the date wheel and lume though.

The date box is not outlined on the dark dial gen on the site.

Still wrong for me.

Its difficult to call. I don't like the lume dots at 7 and 8 o'clock, but maybe Breitling quality control was having a bad day.
Here is a pic of a real one to compare:

http://www.blowers-jewellers.co.uk/imag ... /s9788.htm

The arabics, especially 1 and 11 look different, as is the 12 o'clock triangle.

_________________
Breitling (Navitimer A23322, Aerospace, Chronomat Blackbird, Chronomat A13352 +UTC)
Jaeger-LeCoultre Reverso Gran Sport, Zenith Elite 670
Marathon (SAR, JSAR), Ollech & Wajs Cobra

I agree the 12:00 triangle looks wrong in comparison to the gens.

No date window outline on ade113's pic either. I wonder if that varied on models? Wish I had my Chronologs with me.

I'm still saying fake.

Nevertheless it's gone now.

That was real M1 to me.

It's gone now.

_________________
Quite a few Breitlings, most of them starting with the letter C.

Well I've had a chance to check the old Chronologs and the outlined date window was absent on the first year M1 models but was seen on subsequent year models. It appears that all arabics are stenciled and none are applied.

I still don't like the watch even though I am getting closer to moving over to the dark side. I'm still bothered by the sunken date wheel and the misplaced lume dot at #7; characteristic of fakes as we all know.

The auction was by a 0 feedback seller without any boxes or paperwork what-so-ever - another red flag for a fake. The reverse of the watch either wasn't shown or wasn't clearly shown in the pics, again concerning for a fake.

I'm close to saying it's OK even in spite of the flaws but then I would have to question how those flaws appeared. I don't have an explanation for the sunken date wheel as in every watch I have looked at, the date wheel is fairly flush with the dial. That leads me to conclude that the mechanism is either broken or it's a fake. Could the misplaced lume be a factory oversight? It's possible, but you would think the original purchaser would have sent that back to Breitling.

Too many questions for me that are left unanswered. Too much circumstantial evidence pointing to a fake.
I have to ask myself, would I buy that watch myself? Do I believe it's real enough that I would spend money on it no matter how little that might be? The answer would still be no. I want to convince myself it's real but I just can't.

Just my thoughts.