The Breitling Watch Source Forums

Well I was looking at my watch collection today after adding the Blancpain Fifty Fathoms and the Panerai California 249 (yes, I was fully clothed, so shut up!) and was trying to rank the watches in my head, which started me thinking (always a sign on impeeding disaster) on what really constitues a great watch. I dont mean a really good watch or an excellent watch, I mean a truely, great, watch.

Design is not a factor, that is too subjective! I find many Harry Winston watches visually apealing but that does not mean I dont think they are great watches. Neither is status nor apeal, that Channel J12 ceramic "Marine Diver" has every one oohing and aahing because its so shiny, but a Marine Diver that is only 50 meters water resistance and has no diving features is a whore watch if there ever was one.

Now there is an abundance of good watches out there, a Seiko Monster or an Oris Diver are good watch for instance. Does the job very well, great value, lives forever, and they both have worhorse movements. Good watches!

There is also a slew of very good watches as well, an Omega Speedmaster, a Breitling Chronomat, or a Panerai Base Luminor are what I would call very good watches! Good attention to the finish, upgraded movements, solid feautures that work well, etc. Very good watches!

Then there are excellent watches, thankfully there are quite a bit of these as well. A Rolex DSSD, Blancpain Fifty Fathoms, AP ROO Safari, Panerai Manifattura 8 Days, etc. Extensive attention to detail, rich history, excellent workmanship, in house movements, Excellent watches.

But none of those are what I can honestely say are great watches, so i had decided to set up some criteria, I look forward to your own criteria and thoughts on this!


1- Dedicated movement: Taking the concept of in-house movements to the next level, a truely great watch needs to be home to a one of a kind movement that was developed specifically for the model and entirely built in house based on original designs. This for instance eliminates the Safari, 233, IWC BP/BI from being great watches. The only watch that I own that meats that criteria is my JLC W-Alarm with its Calibre 912 which was developed for the watch and only used in that model.

2- Superior finish: Naturally a Great Watch needs to show that care has been taken in its presentation. I would require a watch to have a hand finished exterior of a certine quality. A few of my watches pass this test, including the JLC!

3- Innovation: I believe a truely great watch needs to bring something new to the table. A new feauture or a new way of doing things. A digital display on a mechanical watch, an extensive power reserve, superior accuracy, dual alarm display, etc. A few of my watches come to mind, including the BI/BP and the JLC again!

4- Impeccable execution: the design must be perfectely caried out, the watches should be reliable and durable within reason and the material chosen needs to adhere to the highest standards. Again I can think of quite a few watches here.

5- Original, distinctive, and purposeful design: The case design should both be functional in that it adds to the functionality of the watch, and be a totally new design. For instance the slew of Pilot and Seadweller clones out there from being great watches. Hublot have a few models that could cut the list if they did not look like they where the retarded cousins of a Royal Oak Offshore. Thhere seems to be a theme going here, as the JLC yet again makes the cut.


I guess the only great watch I own is the JLC W-Alarm! Even though it is not my absolute favorite for subjective reasons such as me being partial to a military related history or generaly a simpler dial unless I am in the mood for a change, it is still the only truely Great Watch I have ever owned!!

Additionally, another great watch that I have been salivating over is also a JLC, check it out:

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Certified watch nut.

I love that Extreme Lab Altair!

It's an interesting topic, the snob in me wants to say that it should be produced by an independent watchmaker, but I recognise that is unrealistic these days - many great watches are produced by independents, but that doesn't exclude the big corporations from producing them as well.

I would say that to me they need to be produced by a single watchmaker - i.e. one individual responsible for the movement from start to finish as a true sign of quality.

I would also like to see your movement exclusivity extended to the case.

Finally, I believe that it should be restricted production to some degree - not necessarily a limited edition, but something that is produced in relatively small quantities.

Just my 0.02.

Wow Roff, we seem to be thinking in sync, I was editing my post to include the case originality and functionality bit as it seems you where typing as well!

I also agree to your point of exclusivity to a certine extent, though a watch of that magnitude would be exlusive based on the price alone, numbered production does sound like a reasonable requirment.

Yeah that Lab is insane! Dont tell anyone, but I have asked my dealer to quote me a number, as I am thinking of foregoing my Patek Nautilus dreams for that beast.

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Certified watch nut.

soooo...are we going to see the fifty fathoms review with many pics?

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SA-Baton White Dial/ProII
Tissot Le Locle

Yes. hopefully soon. Initial reaction is extremely favorable

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Certified watch nut.

Also, I really must apologize for the amount of spelling mistakes in my original post, I really should learn to type slower and more carefully!

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Certified watch nut.

I for one am particularly interested in those pics!

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SHARKMAN

I can't argue with your "5 criteria" Altair, but for me, greatness is also in the eye of the beholder almost as much as it's in the numbers and the statistics. For example, you could conceivably find a watch that fulfills all 5 of the criteria, but you may simply not like it as a watch. In other words, I don't think a watch could ever be called great if you don't like it for some reason.

For me, a truly great watch needs to have that little "X-factor" that makes you feel good when you see it and when you wear it. That X-factor can raise an excellent (or even a good) watch to new levels...... but it's also highly subjective, which means that not everyone will agree with someone elses rating.

I think I would actually have a very VERY hard time coming up with one single watch based on your 5 criteria plus the X-factor.

Bizarrely, especially considering my stance on in-house movements, I think my definition of "great" is actually a bit less stringent that yours!

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Driver8

Site Moderator

I have to agree with Driver here Altair. I like your criteria but I do think a watch has to grab you to become a truly exceptional watch in one's eyes. Afterall we could put 1,2,5 or 10 etc watches side by side that objectively fit the criteria of exceptional and here I think either 2 things happen - 1, we both think they're all exceptional (all good) or 2, one (or more) stand out to you in a very personal way, beyond just the mechanics etc and that X factor extends that particular watch to the realms of the truly great! Its one of those extremes in my opinion.

Still I can't fault your thinking.

What do you think of something like the Blancpain 1735? Or a Patek made with a myriad of complications and low numbers? Would you consider those examples as exceptional?

Congratulations too on the 50 fathoms, that is a nice watch and on my list or watches to try.

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Happines is Good Health and a Bad Memory.
"Ingrid Bergman"

Altair, I have to agree completely with your assessment that your current JLC alarm is a GREAT watch. I love the stylings and functionality of it. I wish we had a JLC dealer around here so I could slap one on the wrist and see it in the metal.

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Breitling Steelfish(black)
Breitling Steelfish(silver)
Panerai PAM 312
Bell & Ross BR03-92 Phantom
Steinhart BreitlingSource LE #5/15

I'm not sure on the aesthetic appeal being necessary to be a great watch. Subjectively that's required to make it the right great watch for an individual, but if it doesn't appeal it doesn't mean that the watch isn't great.

I am not a Rolex fan (with the exception of the SDDS), but that doesn't mean that their watches aren't very good - they just aren't for me.

I guess I see a distinction between a great watch and a great watch that I would like to own.

To me this is kind of like asking what is a truly great song. Everybody will have different criteria and everyone will have a different opinion. Watches are such a personal thing, to some of us at least, that what one person may find truly great another person may find it to be just another watch, no matter how expensive or unique it is. Take the jet-pack looking watch that Roff posted a while back. I believe that it would probably meet all of your criteria, but how many people would really wear it? To me I think that the wearability (is that even a word?) of a watch is just as important as anything else and I don't think that I could bring myself to walk out of my house, or even around my house, in a watch that costs more than said house. It's kind of the same thing with the car analogy, if I had a Ferrari I'd be afraid to leave my garage, but the again if I could afford a Ferrari I might feel different.

That's just the opinion of someone who just got into this whole watch thing. Give me a couple of years and I may completely change my mind.

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"Leave the gun, take the cannoli."

Ah, I'm more in Driver8's "x-factor" camp here.

How can a "great watch" be based on technical, logical criterias? Borrowing the car anecdote, how can there be anything logical about WIS-grade watches -- many of which can cost more than state-of-the-art supercars?!

It's all about the emotions it evokes imho. More than like, more than yearn, it should be something primal, beyond any reason, something that makes you lose sleep at night... a watch that will tempt you to sell your firstborn!!

Ok that's just a joke. But if you are at all into Pams for instance, could you possibly argue that THIS watch (which I believe fail under all the categories above) is not "great"???

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a few Pams...

Roff, you put it more concisely than I could, there are many watches that I would classify as "Very Good" or "Excellent" that I would rather own than some of what I consider to be "Great Watches"

H2F, thats a great example actually, I love that Panerai! I would enjoy it more than any watch I currently own, and I can tell you many would say I am nuts. Taste and appeal are very subjective, quality and standards aren't.

And no actually, as big a Pamophile as I am, I cant say that is a great watch, a good one for sure, maybe even a very good one. But not excellent and certinely not great, it is however extremely desirable!

Maybe I should have thought my terminology better, lets substitute great for Exceptional.

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Certified watch nut.

what is the story behind that PAM pictured? Im very unknowledgable when it comes to PAM

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SA-Baton White Dial/ProII
Tissot Le Locle