The Breitling Watch Source Forums

Hey guys,
This is the situation. I have a guy who is interested in buying my Skyland and he lives both in Miami and in Brazil. Right now he is in Brazil and he wants me to ship the watch to his friends address in south Florida so he can hold it until he gets back at the end of July. He states that his friends address is on his PP account as well.
He gave me a few references on the Rolex forum, and I got a response back from the guy he sold a Rolex GMT to who said everything went fine.
He also sent me a cut and paste of his PP account and it has two addresses. I called PP to confirm, but I have to wait to hear back from them.
The payment would be made through Paypal to me and I would make sure to have the monies removed from my paypal into my bank account prior to sending the watch.
My apprehension is sending it to this other address. It looks like his home address is the confirmed address.
Am I safe as long as I make sure the monies are moved out before sending? I've heard of people refunding/recalling the payment and then the watch is already on it's way.
Thoughts and opinions guys?

_________________
Cheers,
Christopher

Currently...
Blackbird, Black Hercules, PAM 000
Down to a humble three...

I think you should be covered under paypal's seller protection. I had a guy file a chargeback with his credit card company 3 months after I sold him a watch and once I provided documentation that I sent him a package and it was signed for by him, paypal told me I was protected and they would deal with the guy's credit card company and cover the money if they wouldn't pay. I'd get an official answer though from paypal before proceeding.

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Justin
Please contact me via PM for the contact details for Govberg Jewelers
Govberg is an AD for over 50 fine Swiss and German watch brands.
Visit them on the web at http://www.govbergwatches.com or call 800-528-8463

I would get everything in writing from the guy, and signed if possible. Take no chances.

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UN Maxi Marine Ti
B01, BEB
SOH
Aerospace Ti
Chrono SO
Omega 300 Master Co-Axial Chro
Omega PO Chrono.
AP ROO Diver
Titan Black Rolex DSOD Honeycomb Dial

Seems a little too dicey for my comfort level. You'll find another buyer.

Thanks for the input guys. I'm not sure why, but something just makes me feel uneasy about this one. He seems to be a little "rushed" especially for someone who is still out of country and will have to wait for it anyhow.
I asked for his "friends" contact info and he sent me the address, but no contact number etc...
He may be a legit guy, but I still feel uneasy. Gut feeling?
I've been lucky so far with all of my dealings on the forums, and I really don't want to mess up my good streak!

_________________
Cheers,
Christopher

Currently...
Blackbird, Black Hercules, PAM 000
Down to a humble three...

I don't think you can rely on PP to protect you. I would only proceed if you can satisfy yourself independently that the buyer is legit.

As I understand it, PP agrees to "fight" chargebacks on your behalf, but it doesn't guarantee any outcome. It's not insurance. If there is a legitimate chargeback (say a stolen credit card was used), PP will try to make you wear the loss. If it happened to me, there are arguments I would be trying, but nothing I would be overwhelmingly confident about.

Clearing the money out of PP into your bank account won't help. I think you would find that if PP wanted it back, they would just draw it back out of your bank account. If you somehow prevented that, or if you had taken the money out of your bank account by then, they would serve a demand on you and then pursue you for it.

Otto,
PP can really draw monies out of your bank account without permission. ?
I find that unsettling if it is accurate.
Seems like they would need consent from the account holder to do something like that.

_________________
Cheers,
Christopher

Currently...
Blackbird, Black Hercules, PAM 000
Down to a humble three...

You would probably find that somewhere in the PP user agreement, you have already consented to them doing it. Not that I've checked, that's just my suspicion.

I would make the guy send you a wire, a cashier's check (from a US bank), a money order, or go through Escrow.com. He should realize that he is going to make sellers somewhat uncomfortable and be willing to be flexible. There are plenty of ways of paying other than PayPal, and most of them actually cost less.

Escrow.com is the safest way for both parties. It takes a little longer but if he isn't going to be picking up the watch until the end of july, he has time. It costs about the same as PayPal.

Be sure to wait at least 5 days for the cashiers check and then call the issuing bank for verification that it is a cashier's check.

///M

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There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness." --Dave Barry

If its not a confirmed address, dont send it (even though paypal will probably try to screw you either way). Tell him to wire you the money and youll lower your price to minus whatever the paypal fees would have been to offset the wire fee.

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-RJ

For me, those two quotes of yours are all you need to say. Gut-feel is usually a very good barometer as far as I'm concerned.

Unless you are 100% confident (which you clearly aren't), then I'd walk away. They'll be other buyers.

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Driver8

Site Moderator

Thanks guys for all the help. I deferred selling the watch.

So what do you guys think about someone sending a USPS money order and having it cashed prior to shipping?
Should be safe that way correct?

_________________
Cheers,
Christopher

Currently...
Blackbird, Black Hercules, PAM 000
Down to a humble three...

Someone tried to purchase a watch from me two weeks ago using a USPS money order. I researched, called USPS, and barely got comfortable enough to say yes. I told him I was going to sit on the cash for a week to be sure all was clear. After spending waaaay to much time looking into them the SOB walked on the deal three days after he said the check was already in the mail.

Long story short, sell on your terms in which you feel comfortable. I only take bank wires, that you must call and confirm with your bank that they are wires and not direct check deposits. If I've known you or you have a great reputation then I'll take paypal if the buyer agrees to eat those vomit inducing fees.

Unless youre struggling and need the cash, you can sit on the watch as long as youd like. Every time ive listed a watch ive turned down probably 75% of buyers that were actually interested. Sometimes I dont feel comfortable, sometimes they dont. The deal works best when both of you feel comfortable, regardless of referrals. Some of my best deals have been from brand new, zero post members. Ive also had bad gut feelings even after checking referrals and speaking to somebody on the phone. Go with your gut, but dont forget your due diligence.

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-RJ

Certainly talk is plenty cheap on the buy/sell/trade forums. I don't mind it too much as long as there was no attempt to defraud. You just have to put up with that.

I have bought 5 watches and sold 3 that were not through Ebay or ADs. So this is not a huge amount of experience, but yet I think every single transaction was totally unique. Some people only want PayPal, some people absolutely do not want PayPal, some want wires, some want cashier's checks. It is practically impossible to have a steadfast rule about what you will take and what you wont. You really do have to evaluate each person separately.

I have yet to do a "normal" sale. Each buyer has had their preferred method. One had an excellent reputation, and we actually used a local friend of his as an escrow agent who had an even more excellent reputation (admin on another forum). I took a small chance sending out the watch to him before I got my money, but in this case everything I could think of checked out fine beforehand. With my last sale, the guy was adamant (but politely so) about wanting to send a cashier's check because he hates paying transaction fees that are not warranted in his opinion (like PayPal). That might sound a little strange, but he was totally happy to wait 10 business days for me to send out the watch. After I got the check I took it to my local bank and asked the manager what he suggested as a good waiting period. He told me 5 days, then call the issuing bank for verification that it was genuine and that the check had cleared. So I did just that and sent off the watch on the 6th business day and we are all happy with the transaction.

I think it really comes down to a feeling. We can have a pretty good sense of when things add up or don't add up. A person may suggest a transaction that, on the face of it, seems even safer than previous transactions you might have done, and yet not everything this person says "adds up." So if it don't add up, don't do it.

///M

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There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness." --Dave Barry