The Breitling Watch Source Forums

Hey guys,

I think I will be purchasing my first watch very soon! Rather than getting the greatly desired 5k and up watches, I'm starting on the opposite end of the spectrum with an under-$40 pocket watch (probably elgin or waltham). I recently bought the book "The Masters of Contemporary Watchmaking," and it made me much more fascinated with watches, specifically the movements. My "endeavor" is going to be to take apart a pocket watch, and assemble it back together, in hopes of it working. However, whether it works or not in the end is not the whole purpose, it's really to learn more about how watches work and appreciate the work that goes into designing and producing one. I am really interested in watchmaking but it would not go well with my parents if I aspired to become a watchmaker (I, myself wouldn't want to take the risk of going down that path anyways), and so I think this could be a very interesting hobby to begin, "the weekend watchmaker"? I really am just pursuing this because I want to learn firsthand how a watch works. I can read books all day about how watches work but I'm really a visual learner and going about watchmaking by actually partaking in watchmaking would be my best bet.

I wanted to post this thread to, tell my story, of course (maybe keeping you guys updated every so often on how I fare), and ask for help if I need it!

-Crasian1030


EDIT: What tools are necessities in trying to go about this project? I don't want to spend too much on the watch and a tool kit if that is necessary. Maybe $50 total.

$50 is going to be a struggle for a toolkit, especially with a pocket watch because there are some specialist tools.

If we ignore things like sleeve wrenches which are 'kinda' optional because the sleeve isn't part of the movement, then at a minimum you will need:

Straight end tweezers
Set of small screwdrivers (you aren't going to get watchmaker quality on that budget)
Brass lined pliers
Finger cotts / gloves

Your eyes are a lot younger than mine but a loupe will also help - 4x to 8x

That truly is a bare minimum - I use a lot more than that when I take a pocket watch apart / reassemble - hand levers, bench keys, cannon pinion remover, etc, etc, etc. Also, if the watch has problems with jewels, damaged pivots, bent arbors, etc then you are going to need other tools.

You are also going to have problems with the mainspring going back into the barrel without a winder, and without the supplies and tools to clean parts you may have problems getting it running again, but I understand that is less of an issue as this is a 'science project'.

I would stongly suggest that you leave the balance and hairspring as is - as a 'balance complete', don't try disassembling / reassembling that.

I've been looking on ebay for a cheap watch, and the mass majority are "for repair or parts." I originally wanted a working watch that I could reassemble to determine if I did things correctly. However, since it is beginning to seem difficult to find a working pocket watch at a low price, do watches that are "for repair" usually with all the parts it just needs some reworking or cleaning? Some of the descriptions do say stuff like "so and so is broken or missing," but others don't say that.

I have no intentions of taking apart any of the balance and springs.

With the small screwdrivers, what exactly is the difference between good and bad qualities? Are bad ones more susceptible to breaking or chipping? Also, why are BRASS lined pliers necessary? I have normal pliers, but I'm guessing theres a difference...

Sorry for the questions! Kinda new at this haha

The problem with cheap screwdrivers is that they are both low quality steel so liable to get damaged ends which will leave sharp edges to scratch the screws and they will also fit less well making them more susceptible to slipping and scratching the movement.

Many non working watches on eBay will have been raided for parts so there may well be missing pieces, but this is generally obvious as few people will bother reassembling after taking a wheel out (for example). With non working watches the problem may just be dirt (although obviously that will need a proper cleaning to get it running), but it could be something that you can do nothing about without spending money - a broken mainspring for example.

In terms of pliers, brass provides a 'softer' plate than just steel so a lot less likely to cause damage. I would be very reluctant to use steel pliers, and would never use them if they are just household pliers which will have 'teeth' rather than completely flat grips. You are going to be using pliers to remove things like the cannon pinion as you won'tget a cannon pinion remover on your budget and household pliers will destroy that in about 1 second.

I think you should sign up for the timezone watchmakers school (or whatever its called). You pay like $200 or something and they send you a movement and some tools. The school is some reading and videos, and its an accessible, all-in-one place to start.

EDIT:
Here are the sub-$200 kits:
http://www.tztoolshop.com/page172.html

_________________
-RJ

Thanks for the information Roff!

RJ - I actually did see that on another forum or sire, however, that is out of my budget right now. I definitely think it's a great idea, but my dad's only willing to shell out ~$50 at the moment. I honestly wouldn;t want to pay that much money now either. Since this is just the beginning of a hobby, I think I'll tinker around a little before I determine which direction I'll take with this. I'm probably going to purchase the 16 piece set of tools on amazon. It's on sale now or something so it's only like $8. decent reviews, so I think I'll go with that.

Thanks for the suggestion.

It's Chinese rubbish.

Don't let it anywhere near a watch that you want to survive.

....great. I guess your word is better than amazon reviews. I'll keep looking.

Actually, I have another question too:

Are different watch brand parts interchangeable? I'm not saying that every single piece in "watch A" will work in the movement of "watch B," but assuming the watches are the same size, are any parts the same? The reason I'm asking is that there are a lot of "sale for parts" auctions on ebay, and some seem to be really good deals but from a lot of different companies (Waltham, Elgin, Hampden, etc.)

Generally not. There are some specific interchangeable parts but you'll need the Bestfit catalogues for details - you can't get them for $50.

I applaud your endeavor - taking something apart and putting it back together is one of the best ways to learn. This how I ended up being an engineer

Considering the specialized tools required and relative complexity of the task you might consider adjusting your goal to merely disassembling the movement. I've done it a few times and it is pretty interesting and I learned a lot. It's also obvious to me that a much more specific set of tools and knowledge of movement assembly is needed. I'd say give it a shot but don't sweat it if you can't put all the pieces back together again. Good luck and have fun hunting around for screws a tenth the size of a grain of rice on the ground!

_________________
“The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once.” - Albert Einstein

Happy to see you interest in watch repair. I really enjoy the time I put into the craft. I got the bug to do this type of thing from my father. I recently overhauled a family heirloom for a friend. Great satisfaction from this type of "work". I have a 10 lesson CD that I purchased when I started out. Not copied the original disk I paid for that I would send to you if you would like. There are 10 lessons on it. Very informative. I would suggest getting an inexpensive PW that runs and take it apart. Look at the parts and put it back together. It is no fun if the first one you work on never works. That's why one that at least runs is best to start on. (advice my father gave me) the other advice was "they only go back together one way". He is sending me a bunch of old cheap pockets that he has around his bench to play with, he is too old now to do the work, if I can get one running I could help out with a good deal for a practice piece. It is a great hobby that can be taken to any level you like. PM me your info if you want the CD.

Best, Mark

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Rolex 42mm Explorer
IWC Ingenieur

A few others too.

I am finding it incredibly difficult to find a working watch within my budget. I wanted a working one originally because I could then see if I had returned it to the normal state if, after taking apart and reassembling, it worked again. I am now wondering if a broken watch, or at least one that isn't working, will be worth it. OBviously I could still learn from taking it apart, but is there the slightest chance that after simply cleaning the parts it could start working again?



And thank you for the very, very kind offer, but I could never take it!


EDIT: Hows this Roff? http://www.amazon.com/Paylak-TSA9005-Re ... roduct_top

Actually, looking back at the list of necessities that you posted earlier, Roff, I have the tweezers and I don;t think it is really a necessity at this point for the finger cotts. Do you think I could just invest in a nice set of screwdrivers? I think I can work my way around the pliers.

Maybe try calling Otto Frei and ask them if they have some type of budget tool starter kit.

_________________
-RJ