The Breitling Watch Source Forums

Maybe because for many there is a BIG difference between "dislike" and "hate." I dislike Rolex - don't hate them. I dislike Tag - don't hate them. Same for Cartier and others. That I dislike certain watches, does not in any way suggest they are lousy watches. Nor that they are hated.

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SHARKMAN

I suppose this can be subjective, but ive handled the aquaracer chrono extensively and I dont believe the fit and finish is anywhere near current models from those other brands. The WIS problem with Tag is not that they cannot make a good watch. Its that they seem to sell a large protion of their watches with very inexpensive, basic, or bog standard quartz movements and charge a lot of money for them, relative to the competition. It seems like every other dude you see has a $700 Tag, and is fully convinced that he has the finest watch money can buy (btw, every watch brand has these guys, its just that Tags low entry price seems to attract more of them than anybody else). At the end of the day, a watch is a watch, but Tag has a cheesy stigma that comes free with every purchase. Even the new 500m is deceiving. The price seems reasonable and the design and finishing are good, but they have chosen to use a Selitta movement to save money. Grand Carreras are top notch, but $4100 for a GMT and $5900 for an ETA chrono are absurd prices. Resale value is abysmal, and rightly so. I had a BNIB Grand Carrera from an AD with full warranty on the market for months that I couldnt even get half price for.

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-RJ

I must have worked in a "red top" or tabloid in a former life

I ll have to rename this post Tag Dislike....

Seriously in the post "Popular Watch Brands You Dislike(or was it hate )" I got a strong sense of major dislike/hate towards Tag Heuer and just wanted to see what people thought.

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Breanach78

A Few Breitlings.

Does the mean that Tag Heuer has "Hit the nail on the head" as regards a successful watch company and can they be blamed/disliked/hated or generally frowned upon for that???

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Breanach78

A Few Breitlings.

TAG offers too little for too much.

terrible resale value + subpar quality = TAG

I guess somebody has to be the redheaded stepchild of WIS. Regardless of some of the specific reasons for the "TagHate" I think some of it is just that there always has to be someone to pile on. Tag with its low entry price, and large ownership numbers (I would be curious how many started with Tag) make the brand a prime target.

That being said, Tag prolly would rather be considered a low end luxury brand, than a high end value brand.

I have both SuperOcean Steelfish and Aquaracer Chrono here, right now. They both sport a "outhouse" ETA movements (which make both brands look "piss poor and cheap" to the REAL watch snobbies)... but I guess it's safe to say that both have excellent details. At least to my eye.

TAG SELs attach to the case perfectly, the detail is magnificent. The dial is flawless, bracelet brushed/polished areas are amazing, the bezel & clasp operation is smooth and nice, etc. In my eyes it looks like a bit better quality watch, although there's nothing wrong with the Fish, either. Fish is heavier but things like bezel brushing have been executed much better on the 'Racer and the dial crispiness, hour markers, etc. look superb even in huge macro pictures.





I'd like to hear why you think the watch is "not anywhere near" to say, Omega, Rolex or Breitling quality... not saying you're wrong, I'm just curious what makes say, Breitling "much better". I have been owning all kinds of watches for 35 years and I guess it's safe to say that watches are very important hobby to me. But I'm just not "getting" this one.

Please educate me, I'm always willing to learn more.

Thanks.

PS: Measuring "quality" is interesting... I have a $40 hand wind Timex here from the 1970's and it's running perfectly. Has never been serviced. Never. And it's keeping time just fine. What additional things (besides a bit better details and finish) you're getting for the extra $2K? I believe most of this talk about differences between "redneck luxury brands" (Rolex, Omega, TAG, Breitling) is in people's minds. Or then it's just that I'm not enough of a "WIS" to see it.

Appocalypse i agree with some of this statement

"PS: Measuring "quality" is interesting... I have a $40 hand wind Timex here from the 1970's and it's running perfectly. Has never been serviced. Never. And it's keeping time just fine. What additional things (besides a bit better details and finish) you're getting for the extra $2K? I believe most of this talk about differences between "redneck luxury brands" (Rolex, Omega, TAG, Breitling) is in people's minds. Or then it's just that I'm not enough of a "WIS" to see it."

At the end of the day each one of these companies is after a certain part of a market or demograph. And youre right the difference (aside from movements) really is in ones head. But to be honest, IMO there is something that has to be said about the exclusivity of owning a higher end brand. I have been struggling with this alot lately, for example I love Breitling (its a great watch), but i cant help myself from wanting to own an AP ROO. At the end of the day (for me) its really the prestige of owning the name. call me stupid but thats how i feel.

Edit

and although Tag has some higher end pieces, I for one cant buy into the image of the company. I am sure they make a great watch and I have nothing against them but I cant see myself striving to own one the way i want to own AP. If you think about it a watch is really just a watch. You use it to tell time, so if that is ones concern then who cares what you put on your wrist as long as it serves the purpose of telling time.

For me a watch is the ultimate accessory for a guy. So when i put it on my wrist i want to love wearing it.

Believe me, I totally "get" that analogy. I love luxury brands as well. And I understand TAG's cheesy advertising annoys people. I also understand that people think TAG is a bit "annoying".... just like the Porsche snobs never liked the 944, although the turbo version was able to outperform almost the entire 911 line. It never got the respect because "it wasn't a real Porsche". TAG's biggest sin is probably that "it's not the real Rolex" but the poor man's version... but neither is Breitling to the general public... no matter how much people here love the brand.

Image things aside, I'm puzzled how people can instantly tell the quality differences between these watches without some kind of scientific approach. You know... like putting the cases and bracelets through extreme stress... water pressure, different temperatures, etc.

Statements like "nowhere near Breitling quality" are interesting because I don't see any data or visual evidence to back these claims up. I don't see any difference in finish and details, and if there's any I would put TAG's dial print ahead of Breitling (and you need huge macro shots to see it). I've handled the new Link Calibre 16 chronograph and it was absolutely stunning... double AR, display back, that lovely Link bracelet with amazing brushing... although there was nothing wrong with the new Breitling B01, either.

Like I said, watches have been my hobby for my entire life and I can't see how my Breitling is supposedly "superior" to my TAG Heuer... Both watches run pretty accurate, near the COSC standards, etc. and have been 100% functional and trouble free. I've heard of some horror stories about bad "Monday watches" from both manufacturers though.

Rolexes have inhouse movements and I understand (somewhat) that it places the brand to another category... image wise... and unlike Invicta, Citizen, Seiko, TAG & Breitling they do NOT gold plate their "18K gold" two-tone bracelets... and the real top-name brands like Patek, Breguet, JLC and Zenith have taken the details to another level...

And anyone can see the difference between Invicta/Alpha and the real watches... I'm not denying that... but how the bulk, mass produced Swiss ETA (quality) watches like 'Ling and TAG Heuer could dramatically differ from eachother? I'm talking about the high end TAG Heuers, the automatic lineup only... not the overpriced old quartz watches.

Where is this supposed "obvious" quality difference, and how can I measure it? In my opinion, a lot of this "educated WIS talk" in the watch forums is simply nonsense, and the preferences and opinions are rather affected by hearsay, emotion, marketing and image than actual facts.

PS: You know the old story when someone was bragging about how his Rolex "never missed a minute" in the last 30 years. Well guess what, neither did my Timex.

well appocalypse i cant argue against that in any way. in regards to breitling quality is soooo much better than Tag....maybe what people might be reffering to is the high polish finish of of the case and the stainless bracelets???

like anything people will defend their favorite brands and you will always have fanboys on both sides of the fence. i do see what you mean though about how can one gauge quality.

who knows if this place was Tag Source.com you might be arguing the other way...lol

@ apocalypse

First off, I should mention that I screwed up a bit. I was thinking of the carrera chrono, not the aquaracer chrono. My mistake.

Quality, fit/finish etc. are mostly subjective, however there are a few tangible aspects that usually stand out to me. Printing should always be perfect on anything costing over a grand, so thats a given. Water resistance, crystal thickness, AR coating, dial texture and depth, bracelet sturdiness, clasp, strap quality, accuracy, bezel action etc. are things that can be measured against other watches. Intangibles would be subjective, like how sturdy or robust the watch feels.

Ill agree that a true WIS would not be impressed by a Breitling ETA, no matter how modified it was, when measured against an in-house caliber. As far as I know Tag only replaces the rotor on their movements and then charges a huge premium. Longines sells a Hydroconquest for $2000, and its essentially identical an aquaracer chrono. Thats the marketing right there.

Its been my experience that Breitling is in line with other comparable specced watches on the market. Thats means comparing apples to apples, i.e. COSC, modified ETA watches from well known "luxury" manufacturers. Again, compare a similar lever Tag to a Breitling (GC caliber 6 to a Colt, GC, caliber 16 to a B13 breitling), and the Tag is significantly more expensive. A year ago I wouldnt have had the same perspective, but these days there is no way id put that extra dough toward their marketing. Of course, all of our favorite brands are probably guilty of this to some extent, but Tag just seems to be the most guilty.

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-RJ

Yeah... I totally agree. Quartz movement inside anything over $500 watch is a rip-off. Well... I would pay $1K for a Rolex OysterQuartz though... but only because it's collectible and has historical value.

Yeah it's mostly about personal tastes... but opinions and facts should not be mixed. I've never been that much "brand oriented" at all... and if someone called Breitling "crap" in a TAG forum I'd probably post a similar thing about 'Lings.

But honestly, isn't there plenty to like in the current TAG line? Personally, I think they have put out the most desirable and adventurous new watch designs in the past 5 years. I like the new Link Chrono, SLR and even Grand Carrera (after the initial shock). The designs are youthful and attractive to my eye... at least they've been trying... and you gotta be a watch ignoramus to not to respect the Monaco. Great classic! The new Aquaracer 500 is a bit "so and so". Models like F1 and Aquaracer quartz... hmm... I understand why people dislike them, there's nothing to like about expensive and soulless quartz watches. Same applies to Breitling, Ebel and Omega quartz models though (if you forget the Speedy X33/Emergency-like tool watches).

While I love the Navi, BCE, Fish and even Super Avenger I don't like most new Breitling's designs at all. They dropped the ball somewhat, imho. B01 and its "over the top" design is kinda cool though. Rolex has put out the most disappointing models, imho... their new Sub is a visual downgrade... they butchered it with the new trendy & fat design... it was perfect for over 40 years... and replacing the classic Dweller with that ugly thing DSSD was a blasphemy. And how can you replace the classic Pepsi with that boring grey GMT (with polished bracelet). One of my friends said that the GMTIIc is like a rainy Monday afternoon in Belgium. Not to mention the terrible YMII, etc.

My point is... why limit our options? These are 100% taste things and all brands have attractive and not-so-attractive models. When people in the watch forums put down an entire marquee with statements like "TAGs are crap" (without any substantial facts) are simply obnoxious and don't make an interesting debate. If they don't "speak" to you, that's entirely different matter...

Omega has always been the favorite child of WIS (for some weird reason). Whatever they have made in their dark past, is always "ok" and acceptable. Say whatever you want about TAG (or Heuer) but I seriously doubt they ever sank this low.

LOL.. I dont discriminate btw. Ive never been a fan of Omega and have always thought they were way overrated. Not so much from an objective standpoint, ive just never found them to be very interesting. That digi Omega does have a pretty awesome retro look though

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-RJ

im not an omega fan either. like the saying goes different strokes for different folks. to me the DSSD and YMII are the only rolexes worth owning. everthing else is just plain jane.

not a fan of the B01 design either (no offense to the people that own one). the bezel kills the watch.

I think it's time we got off such a divisive topic and turned to something we all can agree on. Hate of Candians. They bombed the Baldwins. The BALDWINS!!

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SHARKMAN