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1st Breitling purchase - questions before taking the plunge!
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Author:  Delabonner [ Sun Aug 07, 2016 5:59 am ]
Post subject:  1st Breitling purchase - questions before taking the plunge!
Hi all, this is my first post so some background info, I am basically a complete novice regards vintages watches, I've been wanting to purchase my first watch for some time now and I've potentially settled on a Breitling Top Time. My initial reason for wanting to own a Vintage watch is purely aesthetic, I simply love the way they look. To me vintage watches have a style and history which is arguably impossible to recreate in today's watches. Obviously I have a hell of lot to learn regards what goes on underneath the dial, all in good time hopefully!

The Top Time I have in mind I suspect may be overpriced, the seller is a watch dealership (Online Shop) maybe familiar to some of you (Vintage-Watches-Collection.com)

If I am overpaying then I can live with that (providing it's not extortionate) if the watch is close to exceptional in quality (i.e. no repairs, improvements required).

After reading the sellers lengthy and informative watch description (to long to fully include here) and then reading lots of past posts from you guys relating to the Top Time I have a question relating to the movement in this watch and if its not too much trouble a further two general questions.

Would a Top Time ref: 2002 from 1967, serial No: 1165085 originally have a Venus 178 movement? if not is this cause for concern?

Based on the pictures below (hope they have uploaded!!) are there any issues / warning signs that I should be concerned about?

If I am overpaying (as I suspect I am) would you be able to tell me what the approximate price for this watch should be?

Watch description: Breitling Top Time chronograph in stainless steel from 1967 model reference 2002. Price £1,875.00 (pound sterling).

Full description here: Vintage-Watches-Collection.com

http://www.vintage-watches-collection.c ... pers-1967/

Extract from watch Sellers description states: 'Breitling Top Time chronograph in stainless steel from 1967 model reference 2002 - individual serial number for this watch, 1165085'. 'Falling between the two extremes of vintage Breitling production for that year of 1122810 and 1204581, this clearly dates the piece as being of 1967 origin'.

Watch dial description: 'dial is not only in a state that can only be described as virtually as-new, but it is also completely original and untouched'

Description further states: 'The original Breitling guarantee and receipt from 1967 is still here, this clearly stating the same serial number that is stamped into the case back'. 'Also here is a service receipt from 2005, which relates to the watch being sent back to Breitling for an overhaul at a cost of £195 GB pounds'.

The part of the description that raises my question states - 'If we look in the table published in Benno Richter’s book “Breitling”, we see that this model, reference 2002, should be fitted with a Venus 178 movement. This is indeed the movement inside the watch here'. Further states - ' When Venus ran into financial difficulties in 1967 and was forced to close its doors, its machine tooling was purchased by rival Valjoux' - ' Thus, after 1968, it is possible to find this exact same movement, also in Breitling watches, but signed with the Valjoux logo as opposed to the Venus star. Notice how the Venus version here is absolutely correct for the 1967 serial number of the case back outer'.

Seller provides 6 pictures in total 4 dial 2 case back - non of the movement.

Thanks in advance for any help/information.
Author:  vintage [ Sun Aug 07, 2016 8:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1st Breitling purchase - questions before taking the plu
For such a meticulous description it's unfortunate his research misidentified the movement as a Venus 178 when, in fact, it's a Venus 175. The Venus 178 is a three sub register movement not found in a reference 2002 Top Time. His price is optimistic also. Check Ebay closed auctions to see what they usually sell for.
Author:  Delabonner [ Sun Aug 07, 2016 8:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1st Breitling purchase - questions before taking the plu
Thanks for the info and advice 'Vintage' much appreciated.

Taking into consideration the overall condition of the watch (based on the photos) and the additional paperwork would the misidentification raise any concerns with you?
Author:  buddman [ Sun Aug 07, 2016 9:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1st Breitling purchase - questions before taking the plu
I think the 2002 has a Venus 188, same as a Valjoux 7730. 2002 Top times later then went on to the Valjoux 7733 and the caseback marking changed to 2002-33.

That piece you found was sold years ago - he never updates his website.

And you won't find one anymore for £1850 retail. Prices have done up. I suspect It's more like £2500 post Brexit exchange rate.
Author:  Delabonner [ Sun Aug 07, 2016 9:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1st Breitling purchase - questions before taking the plu
Buddman thanks for the info on the movement and approx retail price much appreciated. Bearing in mind your info on the seller it looks like I shall have to continue my search for a quality Top Time elsewhere, thanks again for your help.
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