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Early 3-Register Venus 178
https://www.breitlingsource.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=50827		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  vintage [ Sun Nov 17, 2013 7:40 am ]
Post subject:  Early 3-Register Venus 178
Just picked up this interesting piece. Originally owned by a WW2 veteran, aircraft designer, and commercial pilot. The back of the watch does have his name engraved. It's got the earliest serial number for a 3-register I've come across at 452159. No reference number which is not totally surprising. Will have to send it off for an overhaul as it's inop. Interesting hand engraving on the movement and inside the back consistent with import tax regulations on Swiss watches when the US passed a law in 1934. Link here which explains some of that.

http://mb.nawcc.org/showthread.php?73606-US-import-codes-from-when

I can't remember seeing another Breitling with the Wakmann hand engraving inside but they're probably out there.

Seller said watch was found in a storage unit sale. Lucky them.

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Author:  Dracha [ Sun Nov 17, 2013 7:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Early 3-Register Venus 178
Great find Paul ! Nice to see theyre still out there

And funny how far weve come, i remember a time where these hand engravings would have been discarded with 'suspicious and probably fake' i was probably guilty of that as well
Author:  WatchFred [ Sun Nov 17, 2013 7:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Early 3-Register Venus 178
nice one, Paul, would assume mid 30s, earliest signed dial I see.
Author:  Roffensian [ Sun Nov 17, 2013 7:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Early 3-Register Venus 178
Very nice, indeed and definitely very early for a Breitling signed dial.
Author:  vintage [ Sun Nov 17, 2013 8:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Early 3-Register Venus 178
Had the wrong address in the link but fixed now.
Author:  Bill in Sacramento [ Sun Nov 17, 2013 12:15 pm ]
Post subject:  On the date for this one . . .
Since Icko didn't get to New York until 1943, it might be one of the first ones to make it to the US in 1944 or so. I wonder, if there is an engraving on the back, whether a reference number has been removed. But, I guess there is a serial number there, so it is unusual to have "Breitling" on the dial without a reference number. Unusual dial pattern, too.
Author:  WatchFred [ Sun Nov 17, 2013 12:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early 3-Register Venus 178
Bill, the serial number is clearly not in line with a '44 import ?
Author:  Bill in Sacramento [ Sun Nov 17, 2013 12:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early 3-Register Venus 178
Well, I don't know how to date it differently. The three-minute marks on the dial also suggest it was printed after 1942 or so. I think we wait until Paul has it in hand.
Author:  vintage [ Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: On the date for this one . . .
Bill in Sacramento wrote:
Since Icko didn't get to New York until 1943, it might be one of the first ones to make it to the US in 1944 or so. I wonder, if there is an engraving on the back, whether a reference number has been removed. But, I guess there is a serial number there, so it is unusual to have "Breitling" on the dial without a reference number. Unusual dial pattern, too.


I've got a gut feeling that says it's probably from around 1940-42. I haven't been able to find a reference of when the Venus 178 was first used. I've had a few of the earlier models over the years with the single pusher and none of those had reference numbers. Who's to say that Wakmann didn't arrive in New York with an initial supply of Breitling watches that he had inscribed inside for legal import. They would most likely have been earlier pieces but, as you noted with the 3-minute marks on the dial, it wouldn't have been too early a piece to have those. We also know that Breitling has a history of using up old stock until it's gone so who's to say, with definite authority, that this isn't just another early example of that. It's all a bit of a guessing game with the early pieces.
Author:  vintage [ Wed Nov 20, 2013 12:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early 3-Register Venus 178
Updated the pics in the initial post. It's a Venus 152 movement not a Venus 178. Evidently I still can't tell them apart. :oops: Watch measures about 33mm by 13mm w/crystal. Looks like it might need a balance and wound tight too. Hour/min hands are a little strange. The other hands are all blue steel but the hour/min hands appear to be lighter like maybe lumed at one time. They are blue steel where they attach to the shaft so I think original. Hopefully will send it out tomorrow for an overhaul.
Author:  mjfur [ Thu Nov 21, 2013 6:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Early 3-Register Venus 178
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Author:  vintage [ Sun Nov 24, 2013 6:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Early 3-Register Venus 178
Good news. The watchmaker I sent this watch too says the missing case screw (pic above) was inside the watch and was stopping it from running. Runs weakly now and doesn't need a balance. He figures a good cleaning and oiling will take care of it. Asked him to check the hour & minute hands closely to see if he thought they had been touched up or were original. Hoping to have back next week.
Author:  Bill in Sacramento [ Sun Nov 24, 2013 9:24 am ]
Post subject:  I know the feeling . . .
. . . I've been accused of having loose screws lots of time. But, I guess it doesn't stop me . . .
Author:  vintage [ Mon Dec 02, 2013 1:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Early 3-Register Venus 178
Just received the watch back and it looks pretty nice. Someone had lumed the hr/min hands which is why they looked a little strange initially. My watchmaker soaked them in thinner to remove the lume and they were the original blue steel underneath. A full disassembly and new crystal and mainspring and it's running strong.

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Author:  Dracha [ Mon Dec 02, 2013 1:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I know the feeling . . .
Bill in Sacramento wrote:
. . . I've been accused of having loose screws lots of time. But, I guess it doesn't stop me . . .


Ill trade your lost screws for my nowhere to be found marbles ;-)

Paul, thats a great looking watch , can it somehow be traced to the owner 'L K Heuberger' that designed that aircraft ? That would be great
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