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AOPA records
https://www.breitlingsource.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=35031		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  cruvon [ Mon Nov 21, 2011 11:01 pm ]
Post subject:  AOPA records
Was reading some old threads with interest, especially ones that generated much controversy about whether the 54-55 Valjoux Navitimers were the first ones v/s Breitlings claim. Wondering if AOPA records would shed some light on that or better still pilots from that era who might be in their 80's now and still living might know something? Wondering why Breitling doesn't want to set the record straight considering that there are no known examples of Navitimers before 1954?
Author:  Dracha [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
in this topic there's a translated letter from Breitling
http://www.breitlingsource.com/phpBB2/v ... 11&t=19598

but read the whole thread (and others) about 806's , they're quite informative and will fill a few evenings :-)

Grenchen, 11. Mai 2010


Ihre Fragen betreffend Breitling Vintage Uhren
Your questions concerning Breitling vintage watches


Sehr geehrter Herr K.....,
Dear Mr K.....,


Wir bedanken uns für Ihr Schreiben und freuen uns über Ihr Interesse an unseren Breitling Vintage Zeitmessern.
We thank you for your letter and are pleased with your interest in our Breitling vintage timepieces.

Wir werden versuchen, einen Teil Ihrer Fragen zu beantworten.
We shall try to answer a part of your questions.

Die Navitimer wurde 1952 hergestellt aber bis 1954 wurde die Uhr noch nicht in der Öffentlichkeit verkauft.
The Navitimer was produced in 1952 but until 1954 the watch was not yet sold in the public.

Vor 1954 wurde die Uhr als Kleinserie "Government Issue" hergestellt und sie hiess Navigation Timer.
Before 1954 the watch was produced as small series "Government Issue" and it was named Navigation Timer.

Daher stammt der Name Navitimer, der 1955 registriert wurde.
Hence the name Navitimer, registered in 1955.

Wie es häufig der Fall ist mit der Staatsregierung, wurden die Dokumente nicht zur Verfügung gestellt.
As it is frequently the case with the Government, documents have not been made available.

Ausserdem, weil es sich um militärisch ausgestellte Uhren handelt, wurden sie nach dem Dienst wahrscheinlich verworfen.
Besides, because it concerned watches for military purposes, they probably have been destroyed afterwards.

1958 wurde vermutlich eine Serie von Navitimern hergestellt, die mit Gehäuseböden aus dem Jahre 1953 ausgerüstet wurden.
1958 presumably a series of Navitimers was produced which was equipped with back covers from the year 1953.

Deswegen kann es vorkommen, dass eine Navitimer mit einem Zifferblatt aus 1958 eine Seriennummer aus 1953 hat.
Therefore it can occur that a Navitimer with a dial from 1958 has a serial number from 1953.

Unsere Zusammenarbeit mit AOPA hat erst im Jahr 1954 gegonnen.
Our cooperation with AOPA started only in the year 1954.

Den Vertrag (Original oder Kopie) haben wir in unserem Archiv leider nicht.
The contract (original or copy) unfortunately is not in our archives.

Alle anderen von Ihnen angeforderten Unterlagen existieren leider ebenfalls nicht mehr in unserem Archiv.
Unfortunately all other documents requested by you also do not exist in our archives anymore.

Wir hoffen, dass die obigen Angaben die Situation etwas verständlicher gemacht haben.
We hope that the above informations have made the situation somewhat more understandable.

Freundliche Grüße,
Friendly regards,

BREITING SA

Sébastien Baranyai
Customer Relation

(The 'Staatsregierung' is of course the Swiss Government.)
Author:  Roffensian [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
Regardless of the discussion / debate, there is agreement that the AOPA relationship didn't start until 1954 so that won't help with earlier pieces.
Author:  Bill in Sacramento [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
Rene's note reminds us to thank him for that effort and other research he has done. This is a useful letter. The short form translation is: "Here's our story and we're sticking to it." [Recalling that the current company acquired only the name from the original company and that it possesses no documents from that period.] Once the company started advertising the Navitimer start date as 1952, I suspect they feel pretty "boxed in" to that date.
Author:  cruvon [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 10:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
Thanks for the letter and other info guys. I like how they say they made military watches between 52-54 that were destroyed, wonder if they are referring to the Swiss military or to some other that those mystery watches were supplied to?...wouldn't the Rolex and Omega milsubs and all other military watches too have been destroyed if that was the case?;) And also none in the military knew about this special watch or kept purchase docs in their archives to back that up? Some food for thought:)
Author:  Dracha [ Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
thanks Bill :oops: ,

we're all just trying to make sense out of it all without official documentation
Author:  cruvon [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 7:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
Dracha wrote:
in this topic there's a translated letter from Breitling
http://www.breitlingsource.com/phpBB2/v ... 11&t=19598

but read the whole thread (and others) about 806's , they're quite informative and will fill a few evenings :-)

Grenchen, 11. Mai 2010


Ihre Fragen betreffend Breitling Vintage Uhren
Your questions concerning Breitling vintage watches


Sehr geehrter Herr K.....,
Dear Mr K.....,


Wir bedanken uns für Ihr Schreiben und freuen uns über Ihr Interesse an unseren Breitling Vintage Zeitmessern.
We thank you for your letter and are pleased with your interest in our Breitling vintage timepieces.

Wir werden versuchen, einen Teil Ihrer Fragen zu beantworten.
We shall try to answer a part of your questions.

Die Navitimer wurde 1952 hergestellt aber bis 1954 wurde die Uhr noch nicht in der Öffentlichkeit verkauft.
The Navitimer was produced in 1952 but until 1954 the watch was not yet sold in the public.

Vor 1954 wurde die Uhr als Kleinserie "Government Issue" hergestellt und sie hiess Navigation Timer.
Before 1954 the watch was produced as small series "Government Issue" and it was named Navigation Timer.

Daher stammt der Name Navitimer, der 1955 registriert wurde.
Hence the name Navitimer, registered in 1955.

Wie es häufig der Fall ist mit der Staatsregierung, wurden die Dokumente nicht zur Verfügung gestellt.
As it is frequently the case with the Government, documents have not been made available.

Ausserdem, weil es sich um militärisch ausgestellte Uhren handelt, wurden sie nach dem Dienst wahrscheinlich verworfen.
Besides, because it concerned watches for military purposes, they probably have been destroyed afterwards.

1958 wurde vermutlich eine Serie von Navitimern hergestellt, die mit Gehäuseböden aus dem Jahre 1953 ausgerüstet wurden.
1958 presumably a series of Navitimers was produced which was equipped with back covers from the year 1953.

Deswegen kann es vorkommen, dass eine Navitimer mit einem Zifferblatt aus 1958 eine Seriennummer aus 1953 hat.
Therefore it can occur that a Navitimer with a dial from 1958 has a serial number from 1953.

Unsere Zusammenarbeit mit AOPA hat erst im Jahr 1954 gegonnen.
Our cooperation with AOPA started only in the year 1954.

Den Vertrag (Original oder Kopie) haben wir in unserem Archiv leider nicht.
The contract (original or copy) unfortunately is not in our archives.

Alle anderen von Ihnen angeforderten Unterlagen existieren leider ebenfalls nicht mehr in unserem Archiv.
Unfortunately all other documents requested by you also do not exist in our archives anymore.

Wir hoffen, dass die obigen Angaben die Situation etwas verständlicher gemacht haben.
We hope that the above informations have made the situation somewhat more understandable.

Freundliche Grüße,
Friendly regards,

BREITING SA

Sébastien Baranyai
Customer Relation

(The 'Staatsregierung' is of course the Swiss Government.)


Btw any idea who has this original letter from Breitling, was it by email or in paper format, is worthy of archiving for sure!
Author:  Kurt B [ Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
Quote:
Btw any idea who has this original letter from Breitling, was it by email or in paper format, is worthy of archiving for sure


The request to Breitling was sent by member “Chris K”, and the letter was posted by him as well, he was afterwards kind enough to send the original letter to me.

I honestly don’t think that Breitling of today knows much about it, and it’s my strong believe that the letter from them has been created out of the information that Breitling Navitimer enthusiasts / experts (like myself - call me what you want) has gathered.


Kurt B
Author:  WatchFred [ Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
here it is, in a Kurt´s post, archived on this site:
http://www.breitlingsource.com/phpBB2/v ... 15#p165427
Author:  cruvon [ Sun Nov 27, 2011 4:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
Thanks Kurt, WatchFred. What's great from the looks of it based on that letter, is that Breitling is getting serious in part atleast about Breitling heritage and taking input from collectors based on real life examples that are in existence or existed. It's also taking in the knowledge garnered by Breitling enthusasts and experts based on concrete evidence collected by them over the years, rather than just some preconceived notions that they had in instances when they didn't have the records with them.

Also when was that letter dated?
Author:  WatchFred [ Sun Nov 27, 2011 11:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
quoting member Chris K from the linked thread:
"In front of me is a letter of Breitling, dated Grenchen May 11th, 2010"
Author:  cruvon [ Sun Nov 27, 2011 11:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: AOPA records
WatchFred wrote:
quoting member Chris K from the linked thread:
"In front of me is a letter of Breitling, dated Grenchen May 11th, 2010"


Cool, missed that, thanks!
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