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Regulating a watch...
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Author:  jlee5050 [ Fri Oct 15, 2010 4:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Regulating a watch...
Got a technical question...

I got a time piece that I'm regulating because it's been running slow about 5 mins a day... not a modern piece but a vintage one and got some tools available to tinker with... I've been reading about this stuff for a minute now but my questions are....

if you move the needle to the either side (+or- or adv or ret) , does it affect the way the chronograph function runs too? (as in make it faster or slower?) or is there a separate regulator for that? I've read that as in moving the needle, you're only supposed to make moves in very tiny increments?

Second, after making the changes, how long does it take for the movement to "settle"? Would the changes be noticeable right away or would I have to wait for a day or something?

I'm currently using my Ecodrive skyhawk as the official timekeeper.

Any other suggestions/recommendations on how to go about this procedure is always welcome :D
Author:  Roffensian [ Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Regulating a watch...
Oh you are a brace soul :lol:

First off, let's understand what you are dealing with. If you have a solid balance wheel then you can get close to accuracy, if you have a split balance then you need to be realistic about what can be achieved - the screws on the balance can throw accuracy very easily and you don't want to start messing with those without the right charts and some additional tools.

In terms of the regulation, when you move the regulator you are effectively shortening or lengthening the hairspring and the change is instantaneous. The chrono is just an additional set of wheels engaging with the running train so it's accuracy (and hence regulation) is dependent on the same escapement.

However, recognise that accuracy is not an exact science. You can adjuist the watch to + / - 0 on the workbench, but when you wear it you will be in different positions and the error may be considerable again. Accurate regulation is as much art as anything else - measuring accuracy in multiple positions and trying to find a compromise that causes the different errors to counteract one another and end up with a net zero error (or close to it).

In terms of adjustments to the regulator, make small movements to gauge the impact that they have - with multiple vibrations per second a small adjustment can have a big impact. However, also recognise that the regulator isn't a silver bullet - you can't solve every accuracy problem with the regulator.
Author:  jlee5050 [ Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Regulating a watch...
Yea tell me about it... :roll:

So correct me if my math is flawed...

I'm currently measuring a -2seconds for 30 mins... would it be safe to assume that it would calculate to roughly -4secs per hour? 4 seconds times 24 hours would be -96 seconds = little over minute and half minus a day?

I did make some slight adjustments and it seems it got a bit better (before it was -5 mins a day)... would anyone care to put my OCD at ease and tell me if I can do better or a minute and half is acceptable for a vintage piece? I'm not looking to make this COSC certified...

By the way, I busted a Benedict Arnold and picked up my first Omega Speedie Mark 2... gotta love that 861 Lemania~! gorgeous!
Author:  Roffensian [ Sat Oct 16, 2010 4:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Regulating a watch...
Congrats on the Omega

Your math is broadly correct - but it's a brave extrapolation - 2.2 seconds per half hour would measure the same and be -106 seconds, -1.8 would be 86 - safer to measure for longer unless you have a timing machine.

In terms of soing better, well I would submit the watch to 'normal' wear for a day or so and see what the error is - your -96 is only in one position, in a variety of positions it could be -200 or -2.

In terms of whether you can do better - with a solid balance you should be able to get within 30 if the watch doesn't have other issues, with a split balance it's a crap shoot without knowing whether the balance itself is as it should be.
Author:  jlee5050 [ Sun Oct 17, 2010 11:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Regulating a watch...
Yea thanks Roff...

I'm done with it now... it's off for a service... :lol: This is as close as I'm going to get messing with my pieces...
Author:  onewatchnut [ Mon Oct 18, 2010 4:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Regulating a watch...
Good idea! It's very easy to make things worse.

I suspect the balance motion is weak and the hairspring is not contacting the regulator pin(s). That would essentially lenghten the spring and slow down the rate. Five minutes a day is a considerable rate change and is far greater than one would expect from normal variances. Something is going on there that needs the analysis of a watchmaker.
Author:  jlee5050 [ Mon Oct 18, 2010 9:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Regulating a watch...
I was waiting for you watchnut to chime in... :lol:

Thanks for the lesson...

Lately I've been trying to go beyond the realm of just memorizing models and calibers and grasp the knowledge of what makes the watch actually tick. I will admit I have cracked open casebacks a few times and I know it's not a good thing to do when exposed to the elements but I just love looking at all the gears with a loupe/magnifying glass. Fascinating...

What fascinates me even more is how some of these parts are soooooooo tiny that if you dropped one on the floor, it would be nearly impossible to find :shock:
Author:  Roffensian [ Mon Oct 18, 2010 11:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Regulating a watch...
jlee5050 wrote:
What fascinates me even more is how some of these parts are soooooooo tiny that if you dropped one on the floor, it would be nearly impossible to find :shock:



Oh no, you find them - just as soon as you order a replacement :evil:
Author:  onewatchnut [ Tue Oct 19, 2010 5:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Regulating a watch...
jlee5050 wrote:
What fascinates me even more is how some of these parts are soooooooo tiny that if you dropped one on the floor, it would be nearly impossible to find :shock:


It's called "floor time." You log less of it as you gain experience, but it never goes completely away. The parts you have spares for never snap out of the tweezers or fall on the floor. A bright flashlight laid horizontally on the floor helps to find jewels and brass parts. A good magnet picks up the steel ones. Although, I must admit some have never been found. :cry: That's when you shop the supply houses, look for a carcass to pull one from or, when all else fails, make one.
Author:  Novacastrian [ Fri Oct 22, 2010 3:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Regulating a watch...
onewatchnut wrote:
jlee5050 wrote:
when all else fails, make one.


Now that's hard core. My "making things" expertise extends as far as lego and plastacine!
Author:  Roffensian [ Fri Oct 22, 2010 3:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Regulating a watch...
It's sometimes the only option these days. I have a number of pieces put to one side awaiting my abilities to produce parts to develop - you just can't always find parts any more unless you are lucky enough to find a donor.
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