The Breitling Watch Source Forums

Sorry, but I don’t get your point. I can deep dive in a Seiko for a few hundred bucks. I don’t think water resistance is much of a factor in the price/value of any watches, including vintage pieces.

Anyway, the technology available to protect water sensitive watches in 2009 is fairly impressive – long sleaved shirts.

For the heavy stuff umbrellas and rain coats work well. Finally, one might suggest avoiding walking in the rain in any event.

You are rigth 100%, and its a nice hobby.

I agree, if you are alone with your knowledge.

If you're alone on the buyer's market, will not much happen. But if only 5 others anywhere in the world still want to buy, then the market will explode.

You can buy 20 Rolex Daytona´s in one day, no problem, but try tp buy 20 Co-Pilot´s or 20 Datora´s in one year.

Hmmm,

Fair to say you have an interest in inflating prices of vintage Breitlings.

Do you have any evidence of this “speculator manipulation” with respect to vintage Rolex and Patek Phillipe prices which you speak of?

Anyway, Rolex and Patek Phillipe are different beasties in terms of exclusivity and brand awareness. Everyone has heard of Rolex – but I reckon less people have heard of PP than Breitling in any event.

It seems you’re portending the imminent rise of the 10 grand 1972 Breilting 806…it ain’t gonna happen (in terms of real 2009 dollars). Sure, mint vintage Breitlings are special pieces, and I’m sure will continue to gather enthusiasts.

Maybe the days of 30 grand Rolex 6265’s can’t last forever – I don’t know. From my understanding, the market for vintage Daytonas initially went crazy in Italy and Japan in the nineties. Two markets which tend to go nuts for certain fashion trends. From that, the fever spread around the world and took a nicely made, but fairly humble, chrono from a solid and dependable brand to the realm of stratospheric price increases.

Why the same thing didn’t happen to chronos from Heuer, Omega & Breitling is due to many factors. None of which have anything to do with quality, special features or any number of other purely rational reasons.

At first only about the Navitimer 806 from 1972: This Navitimer is not interesting, there are thousends in the market. But the Navitimer 806 from 1954, with beaded becel, Valjoux 72, "BOW" marked and "AOPA" or "B" BREITLING GENEVE dial, this is the rare body. You cannot find only one of them in all the world for 10.000,- $

You'll have to differentiate this.

Yes, I had a long personal conversation with Oswaldo Patrizzi .

Omega and Breitling are the future. You will see, please remember me in 5 years.

OK – this is cool.

Are you the fellow who runs the "Breitling Museum" or "Breitling Lounge" website with the large range of vintage Breitlings? I noticed a wide range of watches from one of these sites on Chrono24 earlier today.

If so, you have some truly wonderful pieces! Now, some of the prices are a little…ummm…“optimistic”.

Please, tell me more about your conversation with Oswaldo Patrizzi. Further, and I do apologise for my ignorance, who is Mr Patrizzi?

At any rate, you seem quite a character…one ostensibly in possession of some time pieces I would very much like to own.

If you would arrange a super-ultra-awesome price for a mint 70s big case Navi GMT…I could help spread your gospel across the Southern Hemisphere!

I await your wisdom! Bring forth unto me a mint 70s beast for a crazy price my gifted European friend!

I shall remember you!

That's the key though isn't it.

The market will always determine value. You can put any price you like on the pieces you sell, but until someone is prepared to pay it then it's meaningless.

And let's be honest - if you could completely trust the market to set your prices then you wouldn't need to list them with high starting bids / buy it now prices, the competition would idctate!

The future prices will be determined by competition for available pieces, and that, and that alone, will determine what happens the next time a rare piece comes to the market.

I agree. I'm putting my Copilot on Ebay at 2pm Pacific Time today (170389948675). With a reserve of course. Going to see what the current market value will be. Don't really care whether it sells or not since it's really a cool piece and the value will continue to go up. Just hope I haven't set the reserve too low.

Paul

I must say, I do consider the potential for seventies Breitlings to gain broad appeal such that prices for mint pieces could shoot up. All it would take is something like a Rolling Stone magazine cover of a musician with serious seventies credibility wearing a 1806 –
cashed up trendsetters would see the light and appreciate such objects for what they are – magnificent artefacts from an era in which they represented the apex of mechanical design.

Really, from an aesthetic perspective, whatever buttons are pushed by a Paul Newman Daytona, Breitling and Heuer decisively hammered them through the sixties and early to mid seventies.

When I look at a mint seventies Breitling Chronomat 7808, I must admit, it seems ridiculous that a Daytona costs so much more.

That logic also holds true for modern pieces as well.

Think of something like the AP ROOs - many people will think that they are horrendously overpriced for what they are but the market can support the price so there are enough people out there to justify it.

Like everything else, it comes down to supply and demand. Supply alone is never enough.

These are the guys that are keeping the prices down in my opinion.

http://www.antiquorum.com/eng/brandindex/pages/catalog_action=load&lotid=6&auctionid=30.html

Everything on their site seems to be underpriced and not real market value. I asked them once what was the estimated value on a first year 18k Universal Geneve chronograph presented to an early WWI aviator and they told me $500-$700. I actually sold the watch to Universal for their museum for over $2k. In addition the Shugart Complete Price Guide to Watches is also unrealistic as to Breitling values. It's like the B's get no respect. I even asked on the Heuer forum once what makes a Heuer cal 11 more valuable than a similar Breitling and nobody had an answer. Interestingly, since I posed that question, Breitling prices have come up a bit to be more comparable. Honestly, I think Ebay is one of the best venues for determining the value of a piece either vintage or current. One can just search the closed auctions to see what they've been selling for.

I've been dealing with vintage Breitling's for 13 years and the prices have doubled in that time. The first two Copilots I sold went for $1200 and $1500. You won't get one that cheap now. I sold the large case Nav's and Chronomats for $750 - $1100. They've about doubled now. Non-chrono's that were selling for $75-$125 are now selling for $250-$750. See what I mean? So, there's no reason not to expect the selling prices to continue to climb as more people discover Breitling and that Breitling isn't just Bling.

Paul

Antiquorum has got a lot of grief lately for their estimates. Remember that the buyer's premium is huge (>20%) and that always keeps prices down as that is factored into what the buyer bids, but not in the auction's declared selling price.

Antiquorum took a big hit to their credibility with estimates at the start of this year when they sold Gandhi's pocket watch with an estimate of $20,000 - $30,000. It sold for $2,096,000!

It was 2002, but look what is the price today ! And what in 5 years ! You will be surprised.

Here we are 4 years into the 5 - how's that boast progressing??