The Breitling Watch Source Forums

Hello:

I am relatively new but passionate vintage Breitling fan. I've got a lovely 2002 Top Time that I purchased in January and last week I acquired a very, very beat up Chronomat 769.

As you can tell from the images, this watch is in poor shape. It is missing the crystal and bezel/bezel insert. Its hands are in poor shape, the crown is not original and the dial is very dirty and has lost much of its detail. There are also soldering marks on the case, in between both sets of lugs (one of my watchmakers believes someone crudely tried to attach a bracelet to the case this way).

However, something about the watch speaks to me. It clearly has a long, unique history. I like watches with stories. Plus, my investment in it is very low ($300). If I were to decide to wash my hands of the watch, I imagine I'd at least break even by parting it out. But I want to pursue a restoration. Two local watchmakers in LA have suggested I'd be looking at anywhere from $1k to $1,600 to bring this back to life. That range takes into account whether I'd be able to source the bezel myself, or have one fabricated, and whether I'd have the dial refinished. Even at $1,600, my total cost on this piece would be less than $2k -- and I don't see these watches selling for less than $2k.

Now, I know some of you purists -- whose stance on the matter I respect greatly -- might say that this watch will always be a Frankenstein because of the amount of work that is needed. Yes, I'd be pulling together parts from all sorts of sources, and maybe even getting a bezel fabricated. Personally, in this case, it doesn't bother me. My intention would be to wear this and enjoy it, and one day pass it onto my son. I'm not trying to own a museum piece, I suppose is what I mean to say.

So, some questions. I really appreciate any help you all can provide. Lurking on the forum for a while, it's clear you are a passionate, knowledgeable bunch. Based on the pictures, what is your sense of the original dial color and case color? One of the watchmakers who inspected it today thought the dial was a silver color and the case a brass plating over base metal. He didn't think it was gold plated, but he wasn't sure.

Also, the serial number is 508812 -- as you can see from the inside of the caseback. That falls outside the range of the serial number list I've seen on this forum. Any sense of when this watch was from and if this low serial number is unique? The movement is unsigned, as the picture shows. I understand this is pretty common? (Fort what it's worth, the watchmaker said the movement is all there and the balance swings, though it very much needs a serious service.)

Now, does anyone have advice/tips for a restoration? I have very competent LA-area watchmakers who can handle servicing the movement and getting a correct crown and hands, but I will need help with the bezel and the dial. As I said earlier, I am open to having a bezel/bezel insert fabricated. Is that doable? It looks like Mark Heist's shop fabricates bezel, but I understand he has a long waitlist, is quite expensive, only does full restorations, and perhaps wouldn't even want to work on such a beat up watch. Also, does anyone have a recommendation on a dial refinishing service or expert? I know the Chronomat 769 is complicated in terms of dial design, so I'd want to go with someone who is a real pro.

Thanks so much in advance for your help. I am really excited to embark on this project.

many questions and I'm travelling, low internet bandwidth, so only short answers/comments.

serial number is low, but not the lowest we have seen - Breitling claims the 769 was launched in 1942; patents were filed in 1940 - so around this oeriod, we have no exact serial number tables before 1944.

as far as we know there were SS, 18k and GP base metal models, little reason for a nickel plated base metal version.

Heists do fab bezels, but the 806 bezel we saw was far from perfect - not commenting on time and money this involves; personal choice. With the new 3D printing technologies it is only a matter of time until decent replacement bezels appear, you might put it aside and wait for some years ? Your best bet would be a complete donor case, these do come up, but at sky high prices.

Dial and insert: Causemann in Germany have a decent die, we see those come up on restored pieces from Germany; imperfect, but by far the best available.

Unmarked movement is correct for the period.

You've said so yourself - parting it out might be the best idea; there is no part besides the movement and pushers here that does not require a huge amount of parts and work - or wait and see if you can pick up those parts in auctions. I know of no watchmaker who could really help you here with a parts stock to make this whole quickly; others may disagree ?

Hello,
My Chronomat SN 508437 is dated 1943, so you can assume that your SN 508812 is also dated 1943 .
For your movement, it is a Venus 175 and the blank chrono bridge is correct .This caliber has been produced in large quantities and there is no problem for spares .
Chronomat cases were either stainless steel, or gold plated , or 14K gold . Maybe some were chrome plated . Caseback with " fond acier inoxydable" indicates a plated case .
Huge work to do on your watch, do not go into rational considerations if you want to go ahead in such a project .

Thanks for the reply. Since we've established this is a gold-plated case, do you know what color the dial would have been? Would it have been white or more of a silver? Thanks!

Thanks for the quick response. I perused the Causemann website -- I am interested. Has anyone here used them and can attest to the experience and quality of the finished work? Also, I feel like I've read posts here that reference a contributor named Chronodeco who has done dial work (sorry, I'm new -- apologies if that is wrong). Is that perhaps another possibility?

Craig does not do refinishing work on dials; he sends them out to dial houses if he has to; he might comment on the typical results himself ....

Search through the 769-related posts on the forum, you will find some examples of decently refinished Causemann dials.

here's one: viewtopic.php?f=31&t=48285

Kirk Rich Dial does some amazing work and is doing vintage Breitling now. I have used them in the past for my Omega dials which came back like factory. But they are expensive. You can send them an image of your dial and they will get back to you usually same day or next with price. Not the case in the past, think they had a personnel change and customer service is better.

Update: Hi all. I sold this watch on eBay this week for $500. It just didn't seem worth it to repair it. I made a decent profit. An eBay buyer named Bill Shaine bought it. I gather he is a known seller of vintage Breitlings. It will be interesting to see if this watch is restored and resold online.

Would not be surprised to see this parted out. Would not be surprised if it is flipped as well.

I would not have taken on this project in ANY case. Good you sold it.

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S. Craig Bergsma