The Breitling Watch Source Forums

Hello,
I have been conducting a social experiment. This has taken months to complete due to the "vermin" I have been dealing with. I am of course referring to selling a collection to a dealer. This should be an easy task.... but not so. The dealers are more interested in reading your body language in order to buy/steal your collection.

My biggest fear is that once I am dead some dealer shark will steal/buy my collection for a price far below its true value. As a good friend of mine said “every collector’s worst nightmare is that the wife will sell the collection for what he told her he paid for it.”

I have been a wheeler dealer for a long time and I know the tricks of the trade. When buying items myself my first question is/was “how much do you want for it?” I said this just in case a person under valued something. In one case I had a person sell me a Rolex Submariner 5513 for $200-. I would have easily paid up to $1000-. Condition was extremely rough/poor however I managed to sell it to a dealer that very same day for $2750-. Today that watch is much more valuable!

ALL PRICES IN AUSTRALIAN DOLLARS
AU$1 = US$0.67

STEP 1 - put together a treasure chest to tempt the dealers with.
I chose 6 watches + an antique bracelet + a pair of south sea pearl earrings.



I have put in my Breitling Navitimer. I wanted to see what the Navitimer is worth.

STEP 2 – present the treasure chest to a dealer and ask for offers.

DEALER 1 – Upmarket suburb – X Bros (name changed to protect the guilty)
On presenting the goods the dealer immediately says “how much do I want?” I reply that I want the best possible price. I indicate that I don’t know the value of these items.

He then immediately say he is interested in the bottom row – all men’s pieces. He inspects the antique bracelet and says he has seen this piece before. He then criticizes the piece stating the emerald sticks out too much. He says the pearl ear rings are of no interest.

Dealer finally says – come back when you have a price in mind and we will see what we can do.

DEALER 2 – City Estate Jewellery Store – John Oldfields (name changed)
On presenting the goods the dealer is very interested in the antique bracelet. Dealer states piece is a genuine Edwardian piece. Dealer has limited watch knowledge.

Dealer say – you look like an astute collector. Best thing would be to put the items on consignment in the store. I charge a 20-30% commission. Dealer states the collection is outstanding and very unusual for my city. Dealer’s wife is very fond at looking at the collection – I notice she is wearing a Cartier Banjoire watch.

Dealer says bracelet would sell for $5000- less his commission.

Dealer says everything is beautiful and very saleable. Dealer says put on consignment for the best possible price.

DEALER 3 – Antique dealer advertising for watches. XYZ Antiques. (name changed)
You have probably seen the adverts already…. Page advert in an antique magazine offering the best possible price for watches. Photos of rare classics with very low prices eg. Speedmaster – buying from $500-

I firstly tried to get a pricing via email. He refused to give prices as such but wanted me to come in. I suspect this is so he can read my body language and offer low.

He offers the following prices:-
TOP ROW – (Ladies pieces) $7000
Ladies Double Diamond Rolex President $5000
Cartier Diablo 18K $1000
Cartier 18K VLC Diamond line $1000

BOTTOM ROW – (Mens pieces) $6000
Rolex TT DateJust w/diamonds $3000
Omega Speedmaster $1500
BREITLING NAVITIMER $1500

Antique bracelet $2500

Pearls – too modern for his store (polite way of saying NO).

He then goes and says he can get a ladies president on ebay for $5000- (this is pure bullshit). I state I am shocked the Breitling is so low. I tell him it is a classic with the bracelet – long, good condition. He says Breitling is very soft in Australia (more BS).

Dealer tells me $13,000 for all the watches. He tells me there is 10-20% margin in it for him. So he would sell the lot for $15,600

LESSONS LEARNT
All dealers are sharks.
Dealers want to see you so they can read the body language and offer low.
Dealers will offer very low on some pieces for no good reason.
Probably better to sell on consignment (provided you can trust the dealer)
Most antique dealers make “Lovejoy” look like a saint.
Wear your watches now – as they will probably be sold on ebay/to a dealer shark on your death. Enjoy now.
Dealers motto – everything you have is junk, everything I have is treasure.

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I need more watches....

Very little there that I feel like commenting on, but I will say in response to this:



If you really feel this way then I feel sorry for you - I hope that doesn't sound patronising.

My family know what my watches mean to me, some members have already asked for a piece to be willed to them, and I know that whether I die tomorrow or live for another 60 years my pieces will be appreciated by those people that are important to me and will hopefully put a smile on their faces when they put them on their wrists and think of me.

Sometimes in life you wonder what makes some people tick.....

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All the best.
Ian

Archie, you gave me some food for thought here, insomuch as I am wondering what to do with my watches if and when something happens to me. Basically, everything I have goes to my brother, if he is still around when I pop off. Even at that, he has nowhere near the feeling about watches that I do. Hmmmmm... I will have to give this some serious thought. That is now my dilemma. I tried years ago selling some things from my Mother's estate to a dealer, and as far as he was concerned, they were virtually worthless.
Cheers,
Carl

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'63 Omega Seamaster, 2014 Omega Speedmaster MarkII

"Those who possess a sense of entitlement are seldom satisfied"

Archie,

I like the way you put it and you are so very right, especially this part: "how much do you want for it"

Too bad youre missing the second half of what should be included, which are the negotiations.

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-RJ

Oh, where to start? Gotta go to work, so this will be short. Rather than a social experiment you are really conducting an economics experiment. A study in the free market system, and you proved it works flawlessly. You offered your goods, they offered their prices (highly varied as it seems in accordance to their needs and their belief on the profit they could make), you decided their prices were not what you needed and on you went. Perfect (I realize you did not intend to sell, maybe some could sense that?). If it was someone's widow or another who knew and cared nothing for the watches these would have been great deals for her. An item is ony worth what someone is willing to pay. If that is more than it is worth to you, you sell, if not, you keep. That is the entire foundation of the free market system. The only reason many of these "luxury" items are so highly proced is because people like us will pay it, if we wouldn't, they would either come down or dissappear completely.
In the end, dear Archie, you proved that the free markets work, work well, and that if you decide to sell your collection a dealer is not the way to go because your watches are worth more to you than a dealer is willing to pay. That is all. As always, interesting post. Further insight into some of the people on this forum!

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Chronomat, Steel/Gold, MOP Dial, 2-tone band (2008)
Super Avenger Black Baton Dial (2009)
Bentley B04 GMT Silver Dial (2013)
Avenger Blacksteel Baton Dial (2014)

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Groetjes Mike

Breitling Windrider Blackbird

As much as dealers can be "sharks", so can you.

Dealing is not going there and asking "how much you give me for this?", and then moan about how much they tried to low ball you. Of course they're going to try, they are dealers!. They buy cheap and sell expensive, that's the fundamentals of reselling!.

Negotiation is an important part of dealing, you should keep this in mind next time.

When I buy a car I always expect the dealer to quote a higher price than what the car is worth, and the dealer expects me to negotiate and to come down a bit. How much I manage to bringing him down is totally a different matter, and is entirely based on my ability to negotiate. What you can't expect is the dealer to offer you the deal of the year at front, that's just not going to happen.

PS. The last thing I will care about when I'm dead will be the reselling value of my watches.

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Collection
GMTIIc
Daytona
Nautilus 5711
Deep Sea D-Blue
Submariner Hulk
Tudor BB - FOR SALE
SOLD
Aerospace
Navitimer World
Bentley GT Racing
Cockpit
Navitimer 01 LE 788/2000

I've gotta agree with that.

When it's my time to be boxed up, unless a relative or good friend specifically wants my watches, they can bury them all with me for all I care! Obviously I'd like them to go to someone who will look after them, but if not.... bung them in the box with me!

Jeez, what a cheery thread this is!

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Driver8

Site Moderator

D8, I would be happy to give your Bentleys the loving home they deserve. If you would like to be certain that I am up to the task I would happily volunteer for a "pre-death trial" whereby I hold on to your watches while you monitor them to be sure they receive the love you think they deserve. I will PM my address!

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Chronomat, Steel/Gold, MOP Dial, 2-tone band (2008)
Super Avenger Black Baton Dial (2009)
Bentley B04 GMT Silver Dial (2013)
Avenger Blacksteel Baton Dial (2014)

Hello All,
I did negotiate with the dealers. The last dealer - I stated that is too low.

He told me he can get a Ladies Rolex 18K President for AU$5000-
I SAID - NO WAY! I then sent him the completed auction results from ebay.....

When the dealer offered $13000- for my box of watches - I responded by saying that was very low. I told him I wanted $20000-

He told me that was not possible.

I told him the 2 18K Cartiers were about $10000- retail each! He said they are only worth $1000 to him. The ladies double diamond president was worth $5000 to him. I told him that was very low. Rolex gents TT - he offered $3000. I told him where can I buy for so low.

Omega Speedmaster $1500 offered. I told him that was low for a mint example with nice dial and bezel.

Breitling Navi - he offered $1500 - I told him that is an $8000 watch! I told him all about Breitling. He said they are soft and not wanted.

I think the dealer is the following:-
1) liar
2) trying to buy at bargain prices
3) absolute shark

I told the dealer - I can see why you have absolutely NO watches in stock..... nobody who is sane who sell to you at your prices.

I tried to buy a Louis Vuitton piece for the dealer - of course his prices WERE REDICULOUSLY HIGH! He only wanted to swap for watches. I told him I can't swap for watches when your prices offered are pathetic.

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I need more watches....

Let me put it this way... If the dealer actually believed he could make decent money reselling the watches he would have bought them, even if it was for more than he would have liked to pay. Dont take it personally.

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-RJ

There is a basic lesson in economics in here somewhere....as well as a few lessons on other things

What do you guys expect the dealer to do?.. pay you fairly? lol. These are luxury goods in a massively declining world market. It just wont happen.

I understand this was just an experiment (though I wonder wtf u would bother), but the reality is you will never get a fair return on most luxury items.

.. unless you buy Panerai

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