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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2020 10:53 am 
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and your theory is that this is a paid Breitling account?
let me assure you it isn’t.
admit the cynicism is sometimes tiring here.


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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Fri Oct 23, 2020 12:26 pm 
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WatchFred wrote:
and your theory is that this is a paid Breitling account?
let me assure you it isn’t.
admit the cynicism is sometimes tiring here.


I was only joking with my post. The guy who posted that joined in April so I've got no issues with that being his first post.

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 Post subject: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2020 9:38 am 
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WatchFred wrote:
and your theory is that this is a paid Breitling account?
let me assure you it isn’t.
admit the cynicism is sometimes tiring here.
Oh the nerve of us peasants to even suggest or joke of such a thing! How dare us!


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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 12:55 am 
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boogiebot wrote:
Is it just me, or do you guys find it rather strange that we get such a shinning response from a new account in this forum. Dare I say it? Is this a shill posting?


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It took me a little while to work out that I think you are referring to my post.

Shill? definitely not, Fan Boy? Probably. Can you prove a negative - ie Im not a shill? Dont know how but for what its worth my post is actually something of a distillation of thoughts I had after putting together a series of videos I did on my youtube channel talking about Breitling. There was some discussion last year about them being lost and in all the G Kern talk I decided to pay some more attention. What I found was fascinating and took me from being slightly positive but unsure of Breitling to really embracing their new direction and their pre 2000 incarnation.


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 Post subject: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:17 am 
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rocinante wrote:
boogiebot wrote:
Is it just me, or do you guys find it rather strange that we get such a shinning response from a new account in this forum. Dare I say it? Is this a shill posting?


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It took me a little while to work out that I think you are referring to my post.

Shill? definitely not, Fan Boy? Probably. Can you prove a negative - ie Im not a shill? Dont know how but for what its worth my post is actually something of a distillation of thoughts I had after putting together a series of videos I did on my youtube channel talking about Breitling. There was some discussion last year about them being lost and in all the G Kern talk I decided to pay some more attention. What I found was fascinating and took me from being slightly positive but unsure of Breitling to really embracing their new direction and their pre 2000 incarnation.
Always good to have a fanboy on this site. Please post a link to your video, this will be some great SEO value for this thread.


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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 4:19 pm 
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Cmon where is the video clip


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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2020 3:01 am 
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boogiebot wrote:
Cmon where is the video clip


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Sorry missed your question - assuming its ok to post live links to my own videos. Here we go:

Part 1 - youtubes problem with breitling
https://youtu.be/Ep19rA3zGQE

and
Part 2 - changes at breitling
https://youtu.be/gRkUEBPbiQI

and
Part 3 - The Watches
https://youtu.be/c9gXO8g4MRg



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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2020 9:33 am 
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rocinante wrote:
Sorry missed your question - assuming its ok to post live links to my own videos. Here we go:

Part 1 - youtubes problem with breitling
https://youtu.be/Ep19rA3zGQE

and
Part 2 - changes at breitling
https://youtu.be/gRkUEBPbiQI

and
Part 3 - The Watches
https://youtu.be/c9gXO8g4MRg

I've only had a chance to watch your first part, but you make some very good points, so I'll definitely watch the other two. Thanks for posting the links.

I came to Breitling in the middle of the Ernst Schneider era and was a fan of pretty much everything they produced for years on end, but they absolutely lost me for a number of years prior to the Kern/CVC takeover. You make a good point that some of the younger guys who only really know the (often highly polarising) Teddy Schneider era designs, will either love or absolutely hate the models (and by extension, the brand as a whole). In that regard, they aren't alone! I personally hated far more than I liked during the years prior to Georges, and it was only my long-standing love of the brand that kept me around.

I think Georges is doing a fine job at the moment bringing back a sense of respect for the heritage, sanity, and cohesion to the brand. Sure, I don't agree with absolutely everything - I'm not really a fan of the "squad" marketing stuff, and I would still prefer Breitling to remain a predominantly aviation-based brand (rather than surfing, and movie stars, and cycling, and motorbikes, etc) as that what's they were when I first came to them - but things move on, and the good outweighs the "slightly less good" many times over to my mind. My only real concern at the moment is the longevity of this renaissance given what CVC are (a private equity firm), and Georges' own plans to sell his stake at some point. But for the moment I'm more than happy to be along for the ride as it's definitely going in the right direction IMO. :thumbsup:

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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:35 am 
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rocinante wrote:
boogiebot wrote:
Cmon where is the video clip


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Sorry missed your question - assuming its ok to post live links to my own videos. Here we go:

Part 1 - youtubes problem with breitling
https://youtu.be/Ep19rA3zGQE

and
Part 2 - changes at breitling
https://youtu.be/gRkUEBPbiQI

and
Part 3 - The Watches
https://youtu.be/c9gXO8g4MRg
Very cool. Looking forward to watching these !


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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2020 4:26 pm 
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Driver8 wrote:
rocinante wrote:
Sorry missed your question - assuming its ok to post live links to my own videos. Here we go:

Part 1 - youtubes problem with breitling
https://youtu.be/Ep19rA3zGQE

and
Part 2 - changes at breitling
https://youtu.be/gRkUEBPbiQI

and
Part 3 - The Watches
https://youtu.be/c9gXO8g4MRg

I've only had a chance to watch your first part, but you make some very good points, so I'll definitely watch the other two. Thanks for posting the links.

I came to Breitling in the middle of the Ernst Schneider era and was a fan of pretty much everything they produced for years on end, but they absolutely lost me for a number of years prior to the Kern/CVC takeover. You make a good point that some of the younger guys who only really know the (often highly polarising) Teddy Schneider era designs, will either love or absolutely hate the models (and by extension, the brand as a whole). In that regard, they aren't alone! I personally hated far more than I liked during the years prior to Georges, and it was only my long-standing love of the brand that kept me around.

I think Georges is doing a fine job at the moment bringing back a sense of respect for the heritage, sanity, and cohesion to the brand. Sure, I don't agree with absolutely everything - I'm not really a fan of the "squad" marketing stuff, and I would still prefer Breitling to remain a predominantly aviation-based brand (rather than surfing, and movie stars, and cycling, and motorbikes, etc) as that what's they were when I first came to them - but things move on, and the good outweighs the "slightly less good" many times over to my mind. My only real concern at the moment is the longevity of this renaissance given what CVC are (a private equity firm), and Georges' own plans to sell his stake at some point. But for the moment I'm more than happy to be along for the ride as it's definitely going in the right direction IMO. :thumbsup:


Obviously I'm a fan of the new direction. I was ok with the aviation focus (worked in the field for over 30 years after all) but I also saw it was limiting - for example if the company only ever talks aircraft where do the superoceans fit it? And its not like the aviation stuff went away - it got added to. Also, I really like that Breitling feels 'closer' to me now - rather than giving a bunch of money to three guys flying a balloon that has zero to do with me - sponsor a triathlete doing the same race I did in 2015 and will hopefully do again soon or a woman surfing the same waves I do feels more real I guess, more grounded - at the risk of parroting their media guys - more accessible and inclusive. (ps I dream of Breitling sponsoring a world tour team but now is definitely not the time).


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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:39 am 
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rocinante wrote:
Obviously I'm a fan of the new direction. I was ok with the aviation focus (worked in the field for over 30 years after all) but I also saw it was limiting - for example if the company only ever talks aircraft where do the superoceans fit it? And its not like the aviation stuff went away - it got added to. Also, I really like that Breitling feels 'closer' to me now - rather than giving a bunch of money to three guys flying a balloon that has zero to do with me - sponsor a triathlete doing the same race I did in 2015 and will hopefully do again soon or a woman surfing the same waves I do feels more real I guess, more grounded - at the risk of parroting their media guys - more accessible and inclusive. (ps I dream of Breitling sponsoring a world tour team but now is definitely not the time).

Superoceans used to fit just fine in the old 'Aeromarine' range. :thumbsup:

For me (and I realise I'm clearly in the minority, or else there'd be no such thing as brand sponsorship!) seeing a "famous person" wearing a watch I like is in no way likely to make me want to buy it more. Knowing that Brad Pitt has been paid to wear a certain watch makes absolutely no difference to whether I like the watch or not. I know that's a personal (selfish?) standpoint, but then dyed-in-the-wool enthusiasts like myself aren't the target audience for that kind of thing anyway ; it's about growing the brand and attracting new customers, so if that's what the company wants to do then it's perfectly understandable.

I guess I liked the fact that Breitling was a niche company catering primarily (but not exclusively) to aviation under the "Instruments for Professionals" tag-line. I was fine with the 'high-end luxury tool watch' concept. However, as you said in your video, that was severely eroded throughout the 2010's, with more and more brash (almost fashion) styles pieces cluttering up the product lines. So considering the starting point, and the fact that in order to grow the brand it has to appeal to more than just pilots and aviation enthusiasts, I think Georges and team have done a very good job so far.

:lingsrock:

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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:10 am 
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I agree. For me the most pleasing thing has been the way in which Breitling have looked imaginatively at their back-catalogue for inspiration. Until recently it was very frustrating seeing the way in which say Omega (or on a smaller scale Zenith) brought out lovely reissues of some past classics, while Breitling, despite one of the richest design heritages out there, seemed to ignore their own pedigree in favour of some pretty random directions. The way in which they now look to draw inspiration from within is very gratifying.


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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:35 am 
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Driver I agree with you on the celebrity endorsements. Personally I don’t care if Brad Pitt is wearing the watch. To be honest (and I’m sure I’m in the minority as well) having a celeb on the site wearing the watch looks retarded. What’s the messaging Breitling is hopping to accomplish here , “hey buy this watch and you can be like Brad Pitt”?? just not my cup of tea. I’m sure the Breitling execs know what they’re doing, I mean look at the fact their sales are up from previous years.


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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 4:44 am 
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I completely agree with the comments on the overuse of celebs. It's one thing to have a photo of someone wearing a watch, but my issue is the amount of focus Breitling is placing on these folks overshadows the focus on the watch itself, and I find that offputting. Plus, I have a rather narrow view of celebs in general, as I think people give them way too much emphasis in their off-screen lives. I'm too busy in my own life to worry about what an entertainer, athlete, executive, etc. does, says, wears, dates, etc.

rocinante, thanks for the video links! I just watched all three of them and learned a lot. I had no idea of the background or history of Breitling for years and years after buying my Navitimer, and until just now I still didn't know a lot of what you discussed. I bought my Navi in 2006 and had no interest in any other watch for a very long time before and after that, and could have cared less about who was in charge of Breitling or where they were headed. I just knew I liked that watch.

Very interesting discussion about high, medium and low notes. I never thought of it that way, but that makes a lot of sense. I also found your discussion about the re-releases insightful. To me, those have always seemed to be counterfeit copies of the original, but I really appreciated the different perspectives.


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 Post subject: Re: Message to Breitling
PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 8:47 pm 
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Nihon_Ni wrote:
I completely agree with the comments on the overuse of celebs. It's one thing to have a photo of someone wearing a watch, but my issue is the amount of focus Breitling is placing on these folks overshadows the focus on the watch itself, and I find that offputting. Plus, I have a rather narrow view of celebs in general, as I think people give them way too much emphasis in their off-screen lives. I'm too busy in my own life to worry about what an entertainer, athlete, executive, etc. does, says, wears, dates, etc.

rocinante, thanks for the video links! I just watched all three of them and learned a lot. I had no idea of the background or history of Breitling for years and years after buying my Navitimer, and until just now I still didn't know a lot of what you discussed. I bought my Navi in 2006 and had no interest in any other watch for a very long time before and after that, and could have cared less about who was in charge of Breitling or where they were headed. I just knew I liked that watch.

Very interesting discussion about high, medium and low notes. I never thought of it that way, but that makes a lot of sense. I also found your discussion about the re-releases insightful. To me, those have always seemed to be counterfeit copies of the original, but I really appreciated the different perspectives.


1. thanks for the kind words.

2. Im kind of ambivalent on the use of celebs - seeing it as a kind of price that has to be paid for modern commerce particularly for something as anachronistic as a wristwatch. I usually hope they arent too expensive, arent actually toxic and with a bit of luck there might be something positive out of it. Thats why I like most of Breitlings ambassadors now - pro triathletes, surfers, pilots, astronauts, cyclists etc would be really really cheap (my guess all of them combined cost less than the badge oris pays for on a single F1 car . Also none are in any way toxic (like Travlota became) actively turning people off. Also - most (not the fighter pilot or astronaut obviously but they are public servants and would cost bugger all for marketing) are doing things that are kind of relevant to 'normal' people and fit with the brand "story" so no F1, Americas Cup or Equestrian.

Note - I've skipped the cinema squad and two people Pitt and Theron - they would be pricey. But again perhaps that's just the price to be paid, quoting the Australian Financial Review:

"With his own money on the line, Kern has wasted barely a second since taking control. No stranger to marketing smarts, he’s introduced fresh optics, from logos to store design; rationalised the number of collections; rejigged communications and the distribution model; reached out to places like China, formerly a no-go zone for bulked-up Breitlings; and roped in old mates like Brad Pitt to help with publicity.Why Pitt? From all accounts he loves watches, he’s known for sporting numerous brands – Tag, Rolex and Patek – on his telegenic wrist, and he’s better known in China than Breitling."

If you're an enthusiast, arent interested in growth and would be happy with Breitling staying a niche player (especially one happy with the narrow focus its had for the past decade) none of that matters to you - every cent spent on marketing is - by definition - a waste of money. Worse - going mass-market may actually put you off what was previously a kind of subversive watch club. What can I say other than 'sorry, that's how capitalism works'. Perhaps that's why a lot of people are going to micro brands these days - as a way of sticking with the low marketing, in crowd only, feel?


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