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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 1:02 pm 
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Driver8 wrote:

@Hunterfate - any pics or links to the new Japan SE Chronomat? The only one I could find is this one....

http://www.breitling.co.jp/hob/products ... nomat_jsp/

....but it isn't flagged as "New". If it IS this one, then I think it's superb....except (and I'm risking being negative again here!) why did they have to give the black dial model a white date wheel and a white boarder round the window? A black date wheel and no window boarder and this would've been the perfect Chronomat for me. (Yes I know, I'm very particular!)


Looks like this model uses the Airborne bezel, but without the rubber inserts. Initially, I had thought that this watch was only being offered in black, but, apparently, it is being offered in a variety of flavors. I'll echo the sentiment I expressed in the "Wings" thread -- for the life of me, I can't understand why these models aren't more widely available.

It looks to me like the cases and bracelets are polished -- I would have loved to see these in a brushed version, as well.

Oh, and while I'm at it, here's another link: https://www.breitling.co.jp/lp/chronomat_jsp/

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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 11:06 pm 
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Driver8 - Jim just posted the link where I saw that Chronomat JSP for the first time, but I cannot find the post where I saw it (was it WUS or here, ageing is taking its toll on my memory :D ).

It doesn't help that all is written in (for me) strange letters :D

EDIT: I found another link with news from April 2018:

https://www3.jvckenwood.com/accessory/h ... vol25.html

BTW I saw the remade Chronomat at Breitling AD here locally and I like the brushed look (minus 'mirrors' on the bezel) but dial looks somewhat empty with new logo.

As Watchfred says one can't make everyone happy


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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 11:35 pm 
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I actually really like the premier models. Having had 3 different Transocean watches including 2 with the bi-compax layout I think this is a step in the right direction.

I have small wrists but I always felt that the Transocean line wore just a bit too big due to the long lugs. The slightly smaller case and new shape I think will make these wear perfectly.

I also always loved the symmetry of the bi-compex designs so I think these look great and I can't wait to see them in person.

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Last edited by natesen on Fri Oct 26, 2018 6:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 11:57 pm 
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I really like this new line of watches. I like how the strap integrates better with the case, and the stripes at the side of the case gives them a nice character. It would be nice to see more pictues, including the back side of the watch.

Anyway, the size of the case and pushers remindes me of the JLC Polaris Chronograph.


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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 12:20 am 
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Hunterfate wrote:
Driver8 - Jim just posted the link where I saw that Chronomat JSP for the first time, but I cannot find the post where I saw it (was it WUS or here, ageing is taking its toll on my memory :D ).

It doesn't help that all is written in (for me) strange letters :D

EDIT: I found another link with news from April 2018:

https://www3.jvckenwood.com/accessory/h ... vol25.html

BTW I saw the remade Chronomat at Breitling AD here locally and I like the brushed look (minus 'mirrors' on the bezel) but dial looks somewhat empty with new logo.

As Watchfred says one can't make everyone happy

Thanks for the additional link. So yes, that was the one I found yesterday - and I think it's superb apart from the white date wheel.

Funny you should say you found the dial of the new brushed Chronomat with the "B" a bit empty looking - that's kind of how I feel about the new Premier. The Premier's dial has a lot of empty "real estate" to my eyes, but conversely I found the new Chronomat's dial absolutely fine when I saw it! :lol: As you say, one can't please everyone all of the time...., but as I've also said on here many times, it'd be a very boring world if we all liked the same things.

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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 1:55 am 
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They look really nice.... very good looking strap.


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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:35 am 
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Fred - I know you're not a bracelet guy, but what went into the decision to use the Navitimer bracelet on these? When I first saw the pics over on timezone, I immediately thought the only bracelet option would be the mesh option. I'm actually really glad to see the Navitimer bracelet available.

My opinion is that I really like the B01 version in 42mm. I don't think the stock photos do them justice but Fred's real life shots really stand out to me. The panda dial is a winner for me. I like the black eye blue dial but I'd love to see how it varies in different light. The curved ends on the straps are nice to see and if I recall, the straps are 22mm so there should be plenty of options available. I'm not a huge fan of the other models but I don't see anything wrong with them.

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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 8:26 pm 
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A few thoughts after looking at the photos:

Likes:

-Rectangular pushers are nice

-42mm is a good size for such designs

-All the wrist shots are nice, especially the BEB and Bentley version. Other than color, anyone knows what makes the Bentley version different that it's called this way?

-The best part I like are some of the details. The info on the sub dials are very well done. Numerals on minute counter are just right in size for reference and does not "eat" into the markers like the Chronomat, that can affect legibility. The hands on the sub dials mirror the same width as the markers so they do not overlap and are easy on the eyes. I like the seconds counter as they mark out every second, unlike the Navi and Chronomat that only mark out every 5 sec interval. The red tip accent on the Sec Hand is just right. Red contrasts the markers very well. The width is the same as the small min markers. The length of of the red tip accent starts from the base of the 5-min markers and ends precisely at the top end of the small min markers. Neat and legibility is optimized.

Dislikes:

-Not sure if killing the Transocean range entirely is a good thing since I know there are many Transocean fans out there. The key issue is that the mass majority often view Breitlings as pieces that would eventually go "obsolete" since the brand often does "major" changes to their lineups. Whether this particular move is a good one, it appears to confirm that belief. It is one issue that has been keeping many consumers away from the brand. They like models that are available for a long long time, and still look the same, and very hard to get.

-I was initially impressed with the wrist shots(perharps due to Fred's fantastic photographic skills) but when I saw the same pieces with the display shot, they don't seem to look that nice to me anymore, like something is missing, and maybe something to do with the wordings. I have to see the actual watch in person to determine. Hmmm... IMO because of the "refinement look", they look best with leather straps and do not seem to look that nice on the Navi bracelet, perharps mash bracelet might suit them better.

-I know the Premier range is a revival of the olden models. However the pieces, even though inoffensive and considered beautiful to many, do not seem to carry off the name very well. To me, "Premier" is a big name and if I am someone who do not know the brand well, I would have thought that this range represents the higher end of the brand, built with precious metal or higher end complications. This range is supposed to portray a certain level of prestige into the brand. However they are just steel models with moderate pricing, and some worst still, with valjoux movements. This actually degrades the brand's image IMO. When I saw the "Premier" name on the dial, I thought it looks weird because the piece does not seem to carry off the aura that the name is supposed to.

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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 4:38 am 
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Regardless of an individual's opinion with respect to a particular watch and/or brand it is nice to see some discussion taking place on the forum!

On another note I am thrilled that the Premier line has a lug width of 22mm! All I could think of is think off is that it was going to be 21mm, thus putting another nail in the coffin of my watch strap case!!



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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 5:52 am 
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56scooter wrote:
Regardless of an individual's opinion with respect to a particular watch and/or brand it is nice to see some discussion taking place on the forum!


Agreed!!!

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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 5:55 am 
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Chronomat01LE wrote:
-Not sure if killing the Transocean range entirely is a good thing since I know there are many Transocean fans out there. The key issue is that the mass majority often view Breitlings as pieces that would eventually go "obsolete" since the brand often does "major" changes to their lineups. Whether this particular move is a good one, it appears to confirm that belief. It is one issue that has been keeping many consumers away from the brand. They like models that are available for a long long time, and still look the same, and very hard to get.


Good point -- I think that some stability as to core lines and models is essential going forward. My suspicion is that, when the dust settles, Kern will have established a framework for doing just that. Time will tell...

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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 8:14 am 
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Moana43 wrote:
Chronomat01LE wrote:
-Not sure if killing the Transocean range entirely is a good thing since I know there are many Transocean fans out there. The key issue is that the mass majority often view Breitlings as pieces that would eventually go "obsolete" since the brand often does "major" changes to their lineups. Whether this particular move is a good one, it appears to confirm that belief. It is one issue that has been keeping many consumers away from the brand. They like models that are available for a long long time, and still look the same, and very hard to get.


Good point -- I think that some stability as to core lines and models is essential going forward. My suspicion is that, when the dust settles, Kern will have established a framework for doing just that. Time will tell...


precisely, Jim.

as said in response to the other post re the TOC and the vintage model Toptime ref. 810 it was inspired by - the design will be back. But the TOC case with the extremely long lugs that made it uncomfortable to wear for many, will not.

I can't and won't comment on specific plans, of course - but many of the "icons" from heritage and the Schneider portfolio, with wings or without, will be revived over the years; some very lovely watches among them I hope you'll like.

@Chronomat01LE: re your expectation the "Premier" would be better positioned with additional complications, the "Premier" got its name because it "defined" form and function of the modern chronograph in the very late 1930s and earliest 1940s, here's an ig post that tries to show that:
https://www.instagram.com/p/BpbkZAnnyUy ... =watchfred

the "complication chronographs" originally had their own ranges, Datora & Duograph, but there are no plans to revive those, so you may well see "modern" Premier with complications announced over the next years ;)



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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 9:45 am 
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@Fred: Yap I know what you mean. But erm....those vintage pieces you have certainly deserve that name, with that achievement and considered the forefront in terms of technology and originality back then. But these new Premier lines, besides the rectangular pushers, and the name, in no way resemble those that you have IMO so I find it hard to relate these new pieces to the original Premiers, let alone define them as descendants or revival of the Premiers. There are also no "achievements" to speak of in this new line. Even if precious metals or high end complications are not applied in this new line up, I would have been more impressed if it was used to introduce a new patent or movement. Instead it is just using a "2nd version" of the B01(not to even mention Valjoux movement for some of them), where Tudor was already doing so before they did. To put things negatively, the Premier B01 appears to be a Tudor Black Chrono inspirated piece.

Don't get me wrong, they are nice and classy, but the "Premier" factor is just lacking in this new lineup IMO. Hopefully like what you mentioned, these will evolve with new achievements over the years.

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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2018 9:52 am 
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Moana43 wrote:
Chronomat01LE wrote:
-Not sure if killing the Transocean range entirely is a good thing since I know there are many Transocean fans out there. The key issue is that the mass majority often view Breitlings as pieces that would eventually go "obsolete" since the brand often does "major" changes to their lineups. Whether this particular move is a good one, it appears to confirm that belief. It is one issue that has been keeping many consumers away from the brand. They like models that are available for a long long time, and still look the same, and very hard to get.


Good point -- I think that some stability as to core lines and models is essential going forward. My suspicion is that, when the dust settles, Kern will have established a framework for doing just that. Time will tell...



I know Kerns will. I understand what he is aiming to do. What I fear is how long he will stay with Breitling and should another CEO takes over, are we looking at the same thing happening all over again :?

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 Post subject: Re: New Premier Models
PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:29 pm 
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Been gone a loooooong time but had to come back to comment on the Premier. That panda is probably the nicest Breitling I’ve ever seen. Not just in new releases but EVER and I will certainly be getting one from Govbergs very soon. Stunning watch.

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