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Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
https://www.breitlingsource.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=56365		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  soyuz [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 6:24 am ]
Post subject:  Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
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Author:  Roffensian [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 6:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
Welcome to BreitlingSource.

The limited edition numbers were fairly deeply engraved so unlikely that it would have worn off, most likely answer is that the number was removed deliberately, perhaps when originally sold by an unauthorized or 'grey' dealer. It used to be common practice to remove serials to prevent the watch being traced back to the dealer that supplied the watch to the unauthorized seller.
Author:  soyuz [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 7:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
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Author:  Wim [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 8:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
Sorry to tell you this but Roff is right on the money. Maybe an untrained eye can't see that it has been polished out but it has. I know this model very well as I have been looking to buy on of these but can't seem to find one with box and papers in good condition. Every one that I have seen has the serial number engraved in the back. You are right saying it's engraved quite deep but it had to have been there! Never saw one without it. And trust me, a good polisher is an artist. I have one working for me and the things he can do with a watch....
Author:  Dracha [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 9:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
I tend to take the OP side , these were stamped deep , 1mm and more , removing it would leave a considerable large indentation ?
Author:  soyuz [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 9:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
Dear Wim thank for your answer.
I'm not a newbie in this world
I'm a collector of vintage watches from 2 generations and I've one of most followed blog in Italy on vintage and modern watches.
My eyes is all, but not untrained.
If , in my experience, I had doubts about the originality and authenticity of the watch in all its parts, I never opened a topic about in Expert Forum breitling watches.

If you observe the second caseback, you can see that that is polished, so the first caseback (my) don't
I see that you have many certainties. But I had the watch in my hand and I only have many doubts
Author:  coltstrong [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 10:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
I think it looks like has been polished.
Author:  soyuz [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
coltstrong wrote:
I think it looks like has been polished.


As you can see the watch in the second picture was be just an "aesthetic" polishing and this has led to a softening of the edges of the writing, of the notches for key, lugs... Although not involved the cancelation of the serial.

How does it happen that my has suffered a deep polishing if there are no signs anywhere in the caseback. A polished watch, is easily identifiable. :wink:

Mine doesn't have any evidence of polishing :wink:


Another news.
Breitling Italy asked me to bring them the watch :!:
Author:  P51 [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 12:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
1mm or more is incredibly deep in relation to serial number depth. Looking at the PAN, I would think this is less than a mm. Deep, yes but I agree with Wim. An expert polisher could remove that and sculpture the redoubt.

Is it possible someone has access to case backs without S N? In the end, does it make any real difference?
Author:  soyuz [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 2:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
P51 wrote:
1mm or more is incredibly deep in relation to serial number depth. Looking at the PAN, I would think this is less than a mm. Deep, yes but I agree with Wim. An expert polisher could remove that and sculpture the redoubt.

Is it possible someone has access to case backs without S N? In the end, does it make any real difference?


The engraving of other writes is about 1mm. I confirm.
According to pictures founded on web the depht of s.n. is the same of thw other engravings.
Some friends (most expert than me) of mine, has hipotized that is a prototype pre series or an piece produced for a non-commercial purpose
Author:  Dracha [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 2:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
Here"s another one with the same caseback

viewtopic.php?p=46860

But , the weird thing , that one has a fake bracelet ? (I dont see the normal chrono/duograph and date on the bracelet)

But these serial and limited numbers are normally not superficially laser engraved but stamped deeply like the rest of the text on the caseback, so not easily polished out
Author:  soyuz [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 2:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
Dracha wrote:
Here"s another one with the same caseback

http://www.breitlingsource.com/phpBB2/v ... hp?p=46860

But , the weird thing , that one has a fake bracelet ? (I dont see the normal chrono/duograph and date on the bracelet)

But these serial and limited numbers are normally not superficially laser engraved but stamped deeply like the rest of the text on the caseback, so not easily polished out


Youre are right

But in topic you mentioned the picture are modified to hide the s.n. and the reference
Author:  Dracha [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 2:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
soyuz wrote:
Dracha wrote:
Here"s another one with the same caseback

viewtopic.php?p=46860

But , the weird thing , that one has a fake bracelet ? (I dont see the normal chrono/duograph and date on the bracelet)

But these serial and limited numbers are normally not superficially laser engraved but stamped deeply like the rest of the text on the caseback, so not easily polished out


Youre are right

But in topic you mentioned the picture are modified to hide the s.n. and the reference



I am probably missing it but in that topic I dont see any mention of 'hiding serial and reference' ?
Author:  Roffensian [ Wed Dec 17, 2014 4:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
I'm not convinced that it hasn't been removed. I am extremely sceptical of any claim about it being a prototype (which should, for this model, be stamped 0000/4000) or similar. That is pure speculation with no history from Breitling to substantiate it. If, and it's a very big if for me, that piece was never stamped then it was likely 'missed' during the production process. Given that the watch was produced almost 20 years ago when far less automation was in place, that's entirely possible.
Author:  Driver8 [ Thu Dec 18, 2014 2:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Question About my Mysterious Chronomat PAN 1995
This is a very strange one. From what I can see in the pictures, I personally don't think it's been polished out. As stated, LE numbers are much deeper stamped than the lightly engraved serial number, so they would be much harder to remove without removing so much metal that it unbalances the gentle curve of the caseback.

However, there are occasionally slight oddities that come out of the factory. My long gone (and much missed) Bentley Le Mans had the LE number stamped in a different place on the caseback to every single other one that've seen. I queried it with Breitling UK when I sent it in for a service and they said that occasionally slightly non-standard stamping of LE numbers (due to the fact that each was unique) did occasionally happen. Therefore on balance I'd say that it's possible (rare, but possible) that a caseback could have been missed completely.
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