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Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
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Author:  FULL_LING2012 [ Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
Breitling just opened a new store at my local mall. I stopped by last night to check it out. I started chatting it up the the sales associate trying to find out what ling will be blessed with a breitling movement next. I'm sad to report it will not be the much awaited navitimer world. He said this year it will be one of the breitling for Bentley models. He did say that avently all will have a inhouse movement, but could not say a time frame. What do you guys think, what model would you like to see with a inhouse movement in it next.
Author:  Chronomat01LE [ Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
BlackBird
Author:  omi [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
The Navi
Author:  Willows [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
I think maybe a 3-hand model.
Author:  Roffensian [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
I wish ADs knew what they were talking about sometimes.....

Breitling has stated that they have capacity to produce 50,000 in house movements a year and that they are satisfied that will be sufficient. If all Breitlings are going to be in house then that means that they are going to reduce production volumes to about 25% of their boom times - anyone really think that's going to happen?

Breitling has already said that they have the design for a 3 hand in house movement but are struggling with the ability to bring it to market at a price point that will make it competitive and profitable.

At this point with Basel approaching Breitling insiders are going to be sworn to total secrecy and with the exception of the top guys at places like BUSA and BUK the distribution network will have no idea what the plans are for new models.
Author:  wessa [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
omi wrote:
The Navi


Your wish has been granted Sir.

http://www.breitling.com/en/models/navi ... er-01/459/

As much as I'm not so keen on the Bentley range I think it makes sense to introduce the cal 01 in at least some of these models. After all the Bentley range is associated with a bit of a prestige factor, relatively speaking.
Given the popularity however, I'd say they should introduce the cal 01 in the Super Avenge but KEEP the rider tabs as they are. That however would most likely drive the price of the SA to a level that would kill the popularity factor.
Personally however, I'd like to see the cal 01 in an updated Superocean Heritage Chronograph with a nice and shiny ceramic bezel and simple straight hands (definitely no current arrow style hour hands please).
That my friends, would go nicely with my Chronomat, Navi and TOC, especially if it was some form of a Limited Edition with a display back ;-)
Author:  FULL_LING2012 [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
Roffensian wrote:
I wish ADs knew what they were talking about sometimes.....

Breitling has stated that they have capacity to produce 50,000 in house movements a year and that they are satisfied that will be sufficient. If all Breitlings are going to be in house then that means that they are going to reduce production volumes to about 25% of their boom times - anyone really think that's going to happen?

Breitling has already said that they have the design for a 3 hand in house movement but are struggling with the ability to bring it to market at a price point that will make it competitive and profitable.

At this point with Basel approaching Breitling insiders are going to be sworn to total secrecy and with the exception of the top guys at places like BUSA and BUK the distribution network will have no idea what the plans are for new models.



The movement that will be in the Bentley model is a new movement they are working on called the B06. Yes they CURRENTLY only have the means of producing 50,000 and WERE satisfied with this, but over a undisclosed period of time they are looking to have the means to put inhouse movements in all models. Or at least offer a inhouse moventment.
Author:  omi [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
wessa wrote:
omi wrote:
The Navi


Your wish has been granted Sir.

Whoops, I meant Navi World.
Author:  wessa [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
FULL_LING2012 wrote:
......
The movement that will be in the Bentley model is a new movement they are working on called the B06.....


Could this be the semi perpetual, replacement for the ETA 2892-A2 based cal 19?
Author:  Roffensian [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
FULL_LING2012 wrote:
Roffensian wrote:
I wish ADs knew what they were talking about sometimes.....

Breitling has stated that they have capacity to produce 50,000 in house movements a year and that they are satisfied that will be sufficient. If all Breitlings are going to be in house then that means that they are going to reduce production volumes to about 25% of their boom times - anyone really think that's going to happen?

Breitling has already said that they have the design for a 3 hand in house movement but are struggling with the ability to bring it to market at a price point that will make it competitive and profitable.

At this point with Basel approaching Breitling insiders are going to be sworn to total secrecy and with the exception of the top guys at places like BUSA and BUK the distribution network will have no idea what the plans are for new models.



The movement that will be in the Bentley model is a new movement they are working on called the B06. Yes they CURRENTLY only have the means of producing 50,000 and WERE satisfied with this, but over a undisclosed period of time they are looking to have the means to put inhouse movements in all models. Or at least offer a inhouse moventment.



At the risk of upsetting you again, I simply don't believe that Breitling are going to produce 200,000 or so in house movements. The cost involved in moving to that scale could never be justified - heck they can't even figure out how to serially produce an in house 3 hand profitably.
Author:  FULL_LING2012 [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
At the risk of upsetting you again, I simply don't believe that Breitling are going to produce 200,000 or so in house movements. The cost involved in moving to that scale could never be justified - heck they can't even figure out how to serially produce an in house 3 hand profitably.[/quote]


Don't flatter your self, nothing YOU say to me would be worth getting remotely upset about. Just curious what makes your word more credible than someone who actually works for breitling????
Author:  Roffensian [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
FULL_LING2012 wrote:
Don't flatter your self, nothing YOU say to me would be worth getting remotely upset about. Just curious what makes your word more credible than someone who actually works for breitling????


Glad to hear it (genuine, not sarcastic).

Sales associates don't work for Breitling, but nothing makes my opinion more or less credible than anyone else's. When I have an opinion that differs from other people I will say so and if I am riht that's great, if I'm wrong - well it's happened many times before.

It boggles my mind that Breitling would believe that they can get to 100% in house production and it boggles my mind that if they did believe that then they wouldn't make a big splash announcement rather than having it leak out.

But hey, that's just my opinion - probably worth what you paid for it, but I'm fully entitled to state it and have it out there for anyone to laugh at when Breitling announnce in house capacity of 250,000 units at Basel.
Author:  FULL_LING2012 [ Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
I don't think they will be 100% inhouse any time soon, I believe you are right there. I do think it is a strong possibility they at some point they will at least offer a inhouse in every model. It may be over a period over the next 20 years, just a example not a exact figure. It is some thing they are working toward one model at a time. As far as being so top secret you can tell me I'm rite when they roll out this Bentley with the B06 at Basel.
Author:  Racerdj [ Thu Feb 28, 2013 6:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
FULL_LING2012 wrote:
The cost involved in moving to that scale could never be justified - heck they can't even figure out how to serially produce an in house 3 hand profitably?
I would like further information. Is the B01 not profitable?
Author:  Roffensian [ Thu Feb 28, 2013 6:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Next ling to receive inhouse movement.
Racerdj wrote:
I would like further information. Is the B01 not profitable?


That's my statement, not FULL_LING2012's.

I am sure that Breitling are making money on each piece that they sell, but they have to recoup a huge amount of R&D costs and infrastructure and I highly doubt that has yet been recovered.

Breitling has invested in infrastructure (people, equipment, suppliers, etc) to allow them to produce 50,000 in house movements per year. Even if they were only going to retain the same combination of complications (i.e. only offer manual or automatic two or three sub chronos with GMT or world timer complications) they would need to add four times the equipment - you need different (and more) machinery to produce in house than to assemble modified ebauches. They would also need more physical space as the footprint would be larger, and they would need more highly skilled (though not necessarily more) staff.

When you add in the likely need for additional complications, not all of which can be added to the B01 base - semi-perpetual and perpetual even if you only mirror what is currently offered, and start dealing with the need for smaller movements for smaller pieces then the R&D costs start shooting up again. Breitling has confirmed that they have a design for a 3 hand in house movement but they cannot produce it at a low enough cost yet to allow it to be priced competitively and still be profitable.

Finally, Breitling is a private company, not part of a group like so many watch companies, and the recent economic downturn hit them hard, and their recovery (based on COSC numbers) has been slower than companies like Omega. With lower revenues for the last few years, plus the cost of all of the equipment and R&D to pay for (i.e. higher costs), I highly doubt that there is cash sitting around for investment. That appears to be improving as designs have started to be actually new rather than old models with DLC or rubber bezels, but it's a long road.

Now if Breitling were to be acquired by a Swatch, LVMH, Richemont, etc then that's a whole different (and potentially very exciting) ball game.
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