The Breitling Watch Source Forums

Guys I came across the very interesting thread of Breitling movement ( http://breitlingsource.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3033 ) , and I had the below thoughts which i thought of sharing with you.

R&D is the most expensive process in any sophisticated industry, it could last for years and it is not a must to a hit a successful end result!

So it is a simple question, what will the in-house movement add? Just the pride of developing and manufacturing in-house or is it on the quest of adding real innovations to horological advancements like the case of Greubel Forsey Double Tourbillon 30° ( http://www.greubelforsey.com/inventions.asp ).

If it is just for the vanity of in-house production, then we watch lovers will lose by paying more for no real addition. But if it is for real innovation, then that is the real blood of continuous prosperity of the industry.

I would say (IMHO) that Breitling and Omega are taking the right path that adds to the benefit of everybody who is interested in luxury watches and they should keep it this way lest they have intention to revolutionize the industry by a breakthrough.

_________________


Time is precious, keep it with elegance!
-Alien13-

Hmmmm......... a potential can of worms you are opening up here Alien13! But certainly a good discussion all the same.

Personally I would love to see one or two high-end Breitling models that contained completely in-house movements purely for the "horological completeness" factor. However, I think (as you stated) that the movement would have to bring something new to the table - for example, like the 8 and 10 day Panerai manufacture movements.

Having a Breitling with a manufacture equivalent of a B17 or B13 in it wouldn't give me any more satisfaction than the current ETA/Valjoux base movements..... and you can GUARANTEE it'd cost 2 or 3 times as much! Take the Rolex Submariner movement for example - yes it's smooth and very quiet, but in terms of function it does the same job as a B17. It brings nothing new to the table. The Panerai 10 Day movement is something new, so that to me is what it's all about.

Obviously I'd be happy with full manufacture movements across the range if they cost the same as current models, but they would clearly cost far more.

In short I like the way that Breitling buy the movement parts and rework them slightly if needs be to meet COSC requirements. That (to me at least) sets them apart from cheaper watch makes who simply case-up off the shelf movements. I think Breitling hit the right spot in terms of trading off "complete horological excellence" against being cost effective. And lets not forget that R&D costs with developing your own movement are HUGE, and could quite easily financially ruin a company if you can't sell enough watches. Personally I'm more than happy for Breitling to continue doing what they are doing for years to come and making great watches!

_________________
Driver8

Site Moderator

Ive always seen this as a sort of Mercedes Benz scenario. Of course, AMG basically rebuilds and reworks the Benz engines for their high performance lines. At the end of the day, you have a engine that is similar to the original, yet completely different.

ferrari, on the other hand, builds their engines all on their own, from the ground up. Performance is similar to an AMG car, but there is just something very special about having that ferrari engine.

Breitlings are the AMG cars of the watch world.

Nice analogy there! I can certainly live with the "AMG of the watch world"!

_________________
Driver8

Site Moderator

That makes perfect sense...and i dont mind speeding with an AMG

_________________


Time is precious, keep it with elegance!
-Alien13-

What is the main problem of the high end watch industry?

Workforce and supplyproblems!

The top companies could sell a lot more, if they could deliver the products. All the smart delivery schedules of those companies are messed up by bad quality or delayed delivery from suppliers. The company can only check the quality of the incoming parts, not before. So to extend quality control, a watchcompany can only either buy the supplier and force their controlsystem and qualitystandards on that company, or build the stuff themselfs. Therefore the training of new industrial watchmakers is a major obstacle (they never get enough).

Now, thats a reason to produce for yourself. But why make Your own specific movement?

You take an 8k US$ Chronomat Evolution, and it has (on the paper) a Valjoux 7750 movement, which is the same as in a 1,5-2k US$ Tissot. That is very hard to argue. Of course, the Breitling watchcase is another quality class, than the Tissot, but still, it at least 4 time the price. So, if You want to get out of the comparability question, You have to offer Your own movement. Or at least a movement, that only a small group of watchcompanies uses.

Its a similar situation in the car industry. If You buy a Mercedes, You want it with a Mercedes engine. Not with a polished variant of an old Volkswagenengine from 1970 with special sparkplaqs. The old Volkswagen engine may be a perfect engine, not using too much fuel, offering good value, having been improved a couple of times, but it will not give You the feeling, that Your engine is something special. And if You buy a Mercedes, You want a special engine in that car.

Now see that point in the watch Industry, specially the top end products (where at the moment the maximum money can be earned). If Breitling keeps on producing watches only with ETA movements, they will never be considered part of the Topwatches, but always be just a tick below. And they will always depend on the Swatchgroup, who will deliver ebauches in time or not. And who will tell Breitling, what quantity, they can get. (Oh, sorry, we need more movements for the new Longines Sport Chronographs, we have to reduce Your quantity for the next two years by 30%. We are really sorry...)


I hope, I was not too confusing, and my english was not too bad, but things like that are very difficult to write in a foreign language.

BG
Thomas

I think it's relativelly easy to argue... Valjoux 7750 in Breitling is COSC sertifyed, mean company made cignificant investment in movment quality improvment, on top of that Breitling assembling movments inhouse - here is huge price increase (quailifyed labor is extremly expensive) compare to Tisson just dropping ready to go Valjoux 7750 in the case.

It's like comparing my hand made guitar with some assembly line Yamaha Even it's exactly the same model, Yamaha always will be 5 times cheaper
Cheers

_________________
Breitling B-1
Breitling B-2
Breitling Navitimer World
Omega Seamaster Planet Ocean Crono XL
Omega Seamaster Professional
TagHeuer Monaco

It is all about professional MANAGEMENT (and yes I am capitalizing it to emphasize its importance).

If a watchmaker will be forced to produce its in-house movement only because they fail to manage their supplier then it will be a big management failure! Proper forecasting, inventory control and building long-tern partnerships (to name but few things) improve the supply control.

Now looking at the other alternative, of going for in-house production to avoid supply shortcoming, this has lots of drawbacks the first of which is charging end users hefty amounts of money for the failure of managing the supply chain. Breitling is very smart in meeting customer expectations of exceptional quality at a competitive price offer. They know very well that an in-house movement will simply be another expensive me-too movement, lest they invest a LOT to introduce something really innovative.

So to sum things up, if watchmakers face problems with their supply chain then they’d better learn to improve their controls and show their professional management muscles for the best of all watches lovers.

_________________


Time is precious, keep it with elegance!
-Alien13-